In your opinion, wich teams are first class right now? In terms of firepower, respect...etc
The current team form, not talking about history...
And second class
If you want more...

Just to know.
You know, those people who like to analyze things we like...

Who else here?

My list:

Top teams

Fc Bayern
Juventus
Barcelona
Real Madrid
Chelsea

Second

Manchester city
Arsenal
Atlético de Madrid
Sevilla
Wolfsburg
Borussia dortmund
Roma
PSG

Third
Liverpool
Manchester united
Valencia
Athletic bilbao
Bayer leverkusen
Lazio
Lyon
Marseille

Fourth
Internazionale (unfortunately)...
Milan (unfortunately)...

In your opinion, wich teams are first class right now? In terms of firepower, respect...etc
The current team form, not talking about history...
And second class
If you want more...

Just to know.
You know, those people who like to analyze things we like...

Who else here?

My list:

Top teams

Fc Bayern
Juventus
Barcelona
Real Madrid
Chelsea

Second

Manchester city
Arsenal
Atlético de Madrid
Sevilla
Wolfsburg
Borussia dortmund
Roma
PSG

Third

Liverpool
Manchester united
Valencia
Athletic bilbao
Bayer leverkusen
Lazio
Lyon
Marseille

Fourth

Internazionale (unfortunately)...
Milan (unfortunately)...

1st Tier

Real Madrid
Barcelona
Bayern

2nd Tier

Juventus
PSG
Manchester City
Chelsea
Atletico Madrid

3rd Tier

Arsenal
Manchester United
Valencia
Sevilla
Monaco
Roma

etc.

1st TIER:
Barca / Real / Bayern

2nd TIER:
‡PSG‡ / ‡Juventus‡ / Chelsea / ManCity / AtleticoMadrid

3rd TIER:
‡Arsenal‡ / Sevilla / Wolfsburg / ManU / ASRoma

4th TIER:
‡BVB‡ / ‡Monaco‡ / ‡Valencia‡ / Porto / Lazio / Benfica / Bilboa

5th TIER:
‡Lyon‡ / ‡Leverkusen‡ / Tottenham / Schalk 04 / Zenith / Liverpool

!...! = a little better than group

Tell me what you think ( I'm sure people may desagree on some stuff, but overall i think i't pretty on the spot)

1st TIER:
Barca / Real / Bayern

2nd TIER:
‡PSG‡ / ‡Juventus‡ / Chelsea / ManCity / AtleticoMadrid

3rd TIER:
‡Arsenal‡ / Sevilla / Wolfsburg / ManU / ASRoma

4th TIER:
‡BVB‡ / ‡Monaco‡ / ‡Valencia‡ / Porto / Lazio / Benfica / Bilboa

5th TIER:
‡Lyon‡ / ‡Leverkusen‡ / Tottenham / Schalk 04 / Zenith / Liverpool

!...! = a little better than group

Tell me what you think ( I'm sure people may desagree on some stuff, but overall i think i't pretty on the spot)

1st TIER:
Barca / Real / Bayern

2nd TIER:
‡PSG‡ / ‡Juventus‡ / Chelsea / ManCity / AtleticoMadrid

3rd TIER:
‡Arsenal‡ / Sevilla / Wolfsburg / ManU / ASRoma

4th TIER:
‡BVB‡ / ‡Monaco‡ / ‡Valencia‡ / Porto / Lazio / Benfica / Bilboa

5th TIER:
‡Lyon‡ / ‡Leverkusen‡ / Tottenham / Schalk 04 / Zenith / Liverpool

‡...‡ = a little better than group

Tell me what you think ( I'm sure people may desagree on some stuff, but overall i think i't pretty on the spot)

Agreed with yours top 3, Barça, Real and Bayern

SunFlash - I would put the portuguese and dutch league too, also teams like shaktar, zenit...its just lazyness from myself =D

PinkFloyd - Good list, but man city never advances too much in UCL... 3rd tier is fine, no?

Agreed with yours top 3, Barça, Real and Bayern

SunFlash - I would put the portuguese and dutch league too, also teams like shaktar, zenit...its just laziness =D

PinkFloyd - Good list, but man city never advances too much in UCL... 3rd tier is fine, no?

Agreed with yours top 3, Barça, Real and Bayern

SunFlash - I would put the portuguese and dutch league too, also teams like shaktar, zenit...its just laziness =D

PinkFloyd - Good list, but man city never gets to quarter finals in UCL... 3rd tier is fine, no?

Agreed with yours top 3, Barça, Real and Bayern

SunFlash - I would put the portuguese and dutch league too, also teams like shaktar, zenit...its just laziness =D

PinkFloyd - Good list overall

Agreed with yours top 3, Barça, Real and Bayern

SunFlash - I would put the portuguese and dutch league too, also teams like shaktar, zenit...its just laziness =D

PinkFloyd - Good list overall

Dynastian98 - Just curious where you put liverpool..

1st Tier

Real Madrid
Barca
Bayern

2nd Tier

Manchester C
Atletico Madrid
Chelsea
Juve
PSG

3rd Tier

Arsenal
Manchester United
Valencia
Sevilla
Roma

4th Tier

Monaco
Bayer Leverkusen
Porto
Benfica
Tottenham
Liverpool
Schalke
Zenit
Dortmund
Napoli
Monaco
Wolfsburg
Fiorentina

5th tier
RB Salzburg
Celtic
Lyon
Inter
Lazio
Villareal
Ajax
Feyenoord
Southampton
Swansea
Everton
Athletic Bilbao
Sampdoria
Augsburg
Borrusia M

@Tuanist, Alex Batak, Emrecan: Real Madrid in the 2nd tier? Are you serious?

Let's get this straight, just in case that you are. The most expensively assembled team at the moment (market value at 535.5m, transfermarkt), historically the most successful club in the World, team that in the past three seasons of Champions League has 2 semi-final appearances and 1 win, the club with the most revenue in the past I don't know how many years... is a 2nd tier club "in terms of firepower, respect...etc (EduardoZ)"

Let's even forget that for a moment. You do realize that if it wasn't for last years crippling injuries, Barcelona would not actually have won a single trophy? If you recall, the injury free Real Madrid was leading on all fronts; leader of La Liga and a perfect season thus far in Champions League. The injury free Real Madrid had a 22 win streak that even the best ever Barcelona squad couldn't accomplish? Their record that year was 18, by the way.

Also, if you recall, the team that ended up winning a treble last season could only park the bus against a depleted Real Madrid? Their win only came following the Chelski-esque type hopeful long ball ended up in the back of the net in big part due to recently departed Casillas' terrible positioning.

I do understand that it was still Real Madrid's fault that they ended up having so many injuries, mostly due to Carlo Ancelotti's insistence on playing the strongest 11 every time. However, we will not have that problem this season as Rafa Banitez is very well known to be a rotation happy manager.

On top of all this, Real Madrid has added real quality and strength in depth this season with the additions of Casemiro, Danilo, and most recently Kovacevic. They were already a better team than Barcelona, and these additions only strengthen that claim because Barcelona has not made any changes aside from Arda Turan who will only be able to play the second half of the season.

Whether you see it or not, this season I think Real Madrid will be the team to beat and their closest rivals will be Bayern Munchen and possibly PSG. Barcelona of course will provide competition, but that is all.

I seriously doubt your football knowledge and understanding if you don't consider Real Madrid to be a club at the very highest levels of quality, respect, and power. Like it nor, Real Madrid simply is the most powerful club in the World. The expensive squad. The club with the most revenue. The most successful of all time. I mean come, you got to be taking the piss.

ANYWAY, sorry for the long post. Here's my list:

[b]First Tier:[/b]
Real Madrid
Bayern Munchen
Barcelona

[b]Second Tier:[/b]
Manchester City
Chelsea
Arsenal
Athletico Madrid
PSG
Juventus
Wolfsburg
Borussia Dortmund
Manchester United
Sevilla

[b]Third Tier:[/b]
Monaco
Porto
Tottenham
Valencia
Napoli
AS Roma
Fenerbahce SK
Galatasaray
Inter Milan
FC Porto
Zenit St. Petersburg
Schalke 04I've only registered in order to make this post. Judging by the amount of lack of knowledge of football of the people here, I could not possibly see myself stay. It's ridiculous. I mean, a 'moderator' who thinks that Chelski is tier 1 while Real Madrid isn't.. is just, lmao.

@Tuanist, Alex Batak, Emrecan: Real Madrid in the 2nd tier? Are you serious?

Let's get this straight, just in case that you are. The most expensively assembled team at the moment (market value at 535.5m, transfermarkt), historically the most successful club in the World, team that in the past three seasons of Champions League has 2 semi-final appearances and 1 win, the club with the most revenue in the past I don't know how many years... is a 2nd tier club "in terms of firepower, respect...etc (EduardoZ)"

Let's even forget that for a moment. You do realize that if it wasn't for last years crippling injuries, Barcelona would not actually have won a single trophy? If you recall, the injury free Real Madrid was leading on all fronts; leader of La Liga and a perfect season thus far in Champions League. The injury free Real Madrid had a 22 win streak that even the best ever Barcelona squad (2009) couldn't accomplish? Their record that year was 18, by the way.

Also, if you recall, the team that ended up winning a treble last season could only park the bus against a depleted Real Madrid? Their win only came following the Chelski-esque type hopeful long ball ended up in the back of the net in big part due to recently departed Casillas' terrible positioning.

I do understand that it was still Real Madrid's fault that they ended up having so many injuries, mostly due to Carlo Ancelotti's insistence on playing the strongest 11 every time. However, we will not have that problem this season as Rafa Banitez is very well known to be a rotation happy manager.

On top of all this, Real Madrid has added real quality and strength in depth this season with the additions of Casemiro, Danilo, and most recently Kovacevic. They were already a better team than Barcelona, and these additions only strengthen that claim because Barcelona has not made any changes aside from Arda Turan who will only be able to play the second half of the season.

Whether you see it or not, this season I think Real Madrid will be the team to beat and their closest rivals will be Bayern Munchen and possibly PSG. Barcelona of course will provide competition, but that is all.

I seriously doubt your football knowledge and understanding if you don't consider Real Madrid to be a club at the very highest levels of quality, respect, and power. Like it nor, Real Madrid simply is the most powerful club in the World. The expensive squad. The club with the most revenue. The most successful of all time. I mean come, you got to be taking the piss.

ANYWAY, sorry for the long post. Here's my list:

[b]First Tier:[/b]
Real Madrid
Bayern Munchen
Barcelona

[b]Second Tier:[/b]
Manchester City
Chelsea
Arsenal
Athletico Madrid
PSG
Juventus
Wolfsburg
Borussia Dortmund
Manchester United
Sevilla

[b]Third Tier:[/b]
Monaco
Porto
Tottenham
Valencia
Napoli
AS Roma
Fenerbahce SK
Galatasaray
Inter Milan
FC Porto
Zenit St. Petersburg
Schalke 04I've only registered in order to make this post. Judging by the amount of lack of knowledge of football of the people here, I could not possibly see myself stay. It's ridiculous. I mean, a 'moderator' who thinks that Chelski is tier 1 while Real Madrid isn't.. is just, lmao.

@Tuanist, Alex Batak, Emrecan: Real Madrid in the 2nd tier? Are you serious?

Let's get this straight, just in case that you are. The most expensively assembled team at the moment (market value at 535.5m, transfermarkt), historically the most successful club in the World, team that in the past three seasons of Champions League has 2 semi-final appearances and 1 win, the club with the most revenue in the past I don't know how many years... is a 2nd tier club "in terms of firepower, respect...etc (EduardoZ)"

Let's even forget that for a moment. You do realize that if it wasn't for last years crippling injuries, Barcelona would not actually have won a single trophy? If you recall, the injury free Real Madrid was leading on all fronts; leader of La Liga and a perfect season thus far in Champions League. The injury free Real Madrid had a 22 win streak that even the best ever Barcelona squad (2009) couldn't accomplish? Their record that year was 18, by the way.

Also, if you recall, the team that ended up winning a treble last season could only park the bus against a depleted Real Madrid? Their win only came following the Chelski-esque type hopeful long ball ended up in the back of the net in big part due to recently departed Casillas' terrible positioning.

I do understand that it was still Real Madrid's fault that they ended up having so many injuries, mostly due to Carlo Ancelotti's insistence on playing the strongest 11 every time. However, we will not have that problem this season as Rafa Banitez is very well known to be a rotation happy manager.

On top of all this, Real Madrid has added real quality and strength in depth this season with the additions of Casemiro, Danilo, and most recently Kovacevic. They were already a better team than Barcelona, and these additions only strengthen that claim because Barcelona has not made any changes aside from Arda Turan who will only be able to play the second half of the season.

Whether you see it or not, this season I think Real Madrid will be the team to beat and their closest rivals will be Bayern Munchen and possibly PSG. Barcelona of course will provide competition, but that is all.

I seriously doubt your football knowledge and understanding if you don't consider Real Madrid to be a club at the very highest levels of quality, respect, and power. Like it nor, Real Madrid simply is the most powerful club in the World. The expensive squad. The club with the most revenue. The most successful of all time. I mean come, you got to be taking the piss.

I've only registered in order to make this post. Judging by the amount of lack of knowledge of football of the people here, I could not possibly see myself stay. It's ridiculous. I mean, a 'moderator' who thinks that Chelski is tier 1 while Real Madrid isn't.. is just, lmao.

Just for fun, here's a list:

[b]First Tier:[/b]
Real Madrid
Bayern Munchen
Barcelona

[b]Second Tier:[/b]
Manchester City
Chelsea
Arsenal
Athletico Madrid
PSG
Juventus
Wolfsburg
Borussia Dortmund
Manchester United
Sevilla

[b]Third Tier:[/b]
Monaco
Porto
Tottenham
Valencia
Napoli
AS Roma
Fenerbahce SK
Galatasaray
Inter Milan
FC Porto
Zenit St. Petersburg
Schalke 04

@Tuanist, Alex Batak, Emrecan: Real Madrid in the 2nd tier? Are you serious?

Let's get this straight, just in case that you are. The most expensively assembled team at the moment (market value at 535.5m, transfermarkt), historically the most successful club in the World, team that in the past three seasons of Champions League has 2 semi-final appearances and 1 win, the club with the most revenue in the past I don't know how many years... is a 2nd tier club "in terms of firepower, respect...etc (EduardoZ)"

Let's even forget that for a moment. You do realize that if it wasn't for last years crippling injuries, Barcelona would not actually have won a single trophy? If you recall, the injury free Real Madrid was leading on all fronts; leader of La Liga and a perfect season thus far in Champions League. The injury free Real Madrid had a 22 win streak that even the best ever Barcelona squad (2009) couldn't accomplish? Their record that year was 18, by the way.

Also, if you recall, the team that ended up winning a treble last season could only park the bus against a depleted Real Madrid? Their win only came following the Chelski-esque type hopeful long ball ended up in the back of the net in big part due to recently departed Casillas' terrible positioning.

I do understand that it was still Real Madrid's fault that they ended up having so many injuries, mostly due to Carlo Ancelotti's insistence on playing the strongest 11 every time. However, we will not have that problem this season as Rafa Banitez is very well known to be a rotation happy manager.

On top of all this, Real Madrid has added real quality and strength in depth this season with the additions of Casemiro, Danilo, and most recently Kovacevic. They were already a better team than Barcelona, and these additions only strengthen that claim because Barcelona has not made any changes aside from Arda Turan who will only be able to play the second half of the season.

Whether you see it or not, this season I think Real Madrid will be the team to beat and their closest rivals will be Bayern Munchen and possibly PSG. Barcelona of course will provide competition, but that is all.

I seriously doubt your football knowledge and understanding if you don't consider Real Madrid to be a club at the very highest levels of quality, respect, and power. Like it nor, Real Madrid simply is the most powerful club in the World. The expensive squad. The club with the most revenue. The most successful of all time. I mean come, you got to be taking the piss.

I've only registered in order to make this post. Judging by the amount of lack of knowledge of football of the people here, I could not possibly see myself stay. It's ridiculous. I mean, a 'moderator' who thinks that Chelski is tier 1 while Real Madrid isn't.. is just, lmao. You're supposed to set a respectable example, man. Not a lightning rod for ridicule.

Just for fun, here's a list:

[b]First Tier:[/b]
Real Madrid
Bayern Munchen
Barcelona

[b]Second Tier:[/b]
Manchester City
Chelsea
Arsenal
Athletico Madrid
PSG
Juventus
Wolfsburg
Borussia Dortmund
Manchester United
Sevilla

[b]Third Tier:[/b]
Monaco
Porto
Tottenham
Valencia
Napoli
AS Roma
Fenerbahce SK
Galatasaray
Inter Milan
FC Porto
Zenit St. Petersburg
Schalke 04

@Tuanist, Alex Batak, Emrecan: Real Madrid in the 2nd tier? Are you serious?Let's get this straight, just in case that you are. The most expensively assembled team at the moment (market value at 535.5m, transfermarkt), historically the most successful club in the World, team that in the past three seasons of Champions League has 2 semi-final appearances and 1 win, the club with the most revenue in the past I don't know how many years... is a 2nd tier club "in terms of firepower, respect...etc (EduardoZ)"Let's even forget that for a moment. You do realize that if it wasn't for last years crippling injuries, Barcelona would not actually have won a single trophy? If you recall, the injury free Real Madrid was leading on all fronts; leader of La Liga and a perfect season thus far in Champions League. The injury free Real Madrid had a 22 win streak that even the best ever Barcelona squad couldn't accomplish? Their record that year was 18, by the way. Also, if you recall, the team that ended up winning a treble last season could only park the bus against a depleted Real Madrid? Their win only came following the Chelski-esque type hopeful long ball ended up in the back of the net in big part due to recently departed Casillas' terrible positioning.I do understand that it was still Real Madrid's fault that they ended up having so many injuries, mostly due to Carlo Ancelotti's insistence on playing the strongest 11 every time. However, we will not have that problem this season as Rafa Banitez is very well known to be a rotation happy manager.y On top of all this, Real Madrid has added real quality and strength in depth this season with the additions of Casemiro, Danilo, and most recently Kovacevic. They were already a better team than Barcelona, and these additions only strengthen that claim because Barcelona has not made any changes aside from Arda Turan who will only be able to play the second half of the season.Whether you see it or not, this season I think Real Madrid will be the team to beat and their closest rivals will be Bayern Munchen and possibly PSG. Barcelona of course will provide competition, but that is all.I seriously doubt your football knowledge and understanding if you don't consider Real Madrid to be a club at the very highest levels of quality, respect, and power. Like it nor, Real Madrid simply is the most powerful club in the World. The expensive squad. The club with the most revenue. The most successful of all time. I mean come, you got to be taking the piss..@Alex: Not that only you didn't place Real Madrid in their rightful tier, but you also put Chelski in Tier 1?? Haha, seriously, I don't know if you're just biased or daft - or possibly both, but it's preposterous. For a moderator who should exhibit qualities such as common sense, fairness, neutrality, and a respectable football knowledge - you've really gone to deep in end in the opposite direction.I sincerely apologize if I may seem like I'm insulting you, I'm really trying my absolute best not to. I just don't understand how one can come to such a conclusion without exhibiting such traits.ANYWAY, sorry for the long post. Here's my list:[b]First Tier:[/b]Real MadridBayern MunchenBarcelona[b]Second Tier:[/b]Manchester CityChelseaArsenalAthletico MadridPSGJuventusWolfsburgBorussia DortmundManchester UnitedSevilla[b]Third Tier:[/b]MonacoPortoTottenhamValenciaNapoliAS RomaFenerbahce SKGalatasarayInter MilanFC PortoZenit St. PetersburgSchalke 04Let me know if anyone disagrees with anyone on my list, and/or would like an explanation as to why I placed a certain team in their respective tiers.

Well, regardless how flawed your opinion of the current squad might be - mind you it is still the most valuable squad in the World according to transfermarkt ( http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/spieler-statistik/wertvollstemannschaften/marktwertetop ). The thread is not just about the strength of the squad (though Real has the strongest squad in the World at the moment), it is also about power and respect each club posseses in the world of football. As far as those two variables are concerned, Real Madrid are without a doubt the most respected, as well as the most powerful footballing institutions.Getting back to the squad however, what do you base your opinion on? You've not provided a single reason to back up your opinion so I'm left with assuming that it's either a bias or some kind of a dislike of the club - which by the way should have no bearing on the subject. Considering the coach, we've so far only have seen a few pre-season games to judge how the team will line up and what they have shown have been very positive.Out of 9 games that we've played, we've only conceded 3 goals. These 7 games have been against: Manchester City, AS Roma, Inter and AC Milan, Tottenham, Bayern Munich, Galatasaray, and the Norway side (can't recall the name). The only game we did lose was against Bayern Munich with a measly score of 1-0. However, it must be mentioned that neither Ronaldo or Benzema played against Bayern. It is not a unreasonable to assume that had they played, we would've won. The total pre-season score is 11 scored, 3 conceded.In comparison, you look at Barcelona's only last 3 games: one against Sevilla, and two against Athletic Bilbao. They have conceded a total of 9 goals, while only scoring 6. 5 vs Sevilla and 1 vs Bilbao. Their other pre-season games have been just as dismal.And yet, here you are, saying that Barcelona is a notch higher on the list.*Shaking my head.When it comes to ratings such as this one, do not let your emotions get the best of you. Even though I myself detest Barcelona, I will still not be as idiot as to say that they do not belong in Tier 1. That is just clear bias.In the World of football, there are some facts that everybody accepts regardless of team/player/Country you support or reside in. Real Madrid, Bayern, and Barcelona being the top 3 and in a league of their own is ONE of those things. And when you express an opinion that doesn't sit well with what is already accepted, you are going to be ridiculed.You (or anybody for that matter) saying that Real Madrid does not belong in Tier 1 or the small group of the top top quality clubs is just as bad, if not worse, than Mourinho saying that Hazard is better than Ronaldo.

Well, regardless how flawed your opinion of the current squad might be - mind you it is still the most valuable squad in the World according to transfermarkt ( http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/spieler-statistik/wertvollstemannschaften/marktwertetop ).

The thread is not just about the strength of the squad (though Real has the strongest squad in the World at the moment), it is also about power and respect each club posseses in the world of football. As far as those two variables are concerned, Real Madrid are without a doubt the most respected, as well as the most powerful footballing institutions.

Getting back to the squad however, what do you base your opinion on? You've not provided a single reason to back up your opinion so I'm left with assuming that it's either a bias or some kind of a dislike of the club - which by the way should have no bearing on the subject. Considering the manager, we've so far only have seen a few pre-season games to judge how the team will line up and what they have shown have been very positive.

Out of 9 games that we've played, we've only conceded 3 goals. These 9 games have been against: Manchester City, AS Roma, Inter and AC Milan, Tottenham, Bayern Munich, Galatasaray, and the Norway side (can't recall the name). The only game we did lose was against Bayern Munich with a measly score of 1-0. However, it must be mentioned that neither Ronaldo or Benzema played against Bayern. It is not a unreasonable to assume that had they played, we would've won. The total pre-season score is 11 scored, 3 conceded.

In comparison, you look at Barcelona's only last 3 games: one against Sevilla, and two against Athletic Bilbao. They have conceded a total of 9 goals, while only scoring 6. 5 vs Sevilla and 1 vs Bilbao. Their other pre-season games have been just as dismal.And yet, here you are, saying that Barcelona is a notch higher on the list.

*Shaking my head...

When it comes to ratings such as this one, do not let your emotions get the best of you. Even though I myself detest Barcelona, I will still not be as idiot as to say that they do not belong in Tier 1. That is just clear bias.

In the World of football, there are some facts that everybody accepts regardless of team/player/Country you support or reside in. Real Madrid, Bayern, and Barcelona being the top 3 and in a league of their own is ONE of those things. And when you express an opinion that doesn't sit well with what is already accepted, you are going to be ridiculed. Believe me, I am having difficulty containing myself.

You (or anybody for that matter) saying that Real Madrid does not belong in Tier 1 or the small group of the top top quality clubs is just as bad, if not worse, than Mourinho saying that Hazard is better than Ronaldo.

Well, regardless how flawed your opinion of the current squad might be - mind you it is still the most valuable squad in the World according to transfermarkt ( http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/spieler-statistik/wertvollstemannschaften/marktwertetop ).

The thread is not just about the strength of the squad (though Real has the strongest squad in the World at the moment), it is also about power and respect each club posseses in the world of football. As far as those two variables are concerned, Real Madrid are without a doubt one of the most respected, as well as the most powerful footballing institution on the planet.

Getting back to the squad however, what do you base your opinion on? You've not provided a single reason to back up your opinion so I'm left with assuming that it's either a bias or some kind of a dislike of the club - which by the way should have no bearing on the subject. Considering the manager, we've so far only have seen a few pre-season games to judge how the team will line up and what they have shown have been very positive.

Out of 9 games that we've played, we've only conceded 3 goals. These 9 games have been against: Manchester City, AS Roma, Inter and AC Milan, Tottenham, Bayern Munich, Galatasaray, and the Norway side (can't recall the name). The only game we did lose was against Bayern Munich with a measly score of 1-0. However, it must be mentioned that neither Ronaldo or Benzema played against Bayern. It is not a unreasonable to assume that had they played, we would've won. The total pre-season score is 11 scored, 3 conceded.

In comparison, you look at Barcelona's only last 3 games: one against Sevilla, and two against Athletic Bilbao. They have conceded a total of 9 goals, while only scoring 6. 5 vs Sevilla and 1 vs Bilbao. Their other pre-season games have been just as dismal.And yet, here you are, saying that Barcelona is a notch higher on the list.

*Shaking my head...

When it comes to ratings such as this one, do not let your emotions get the best of you. Even though I myself detest Barcelona, I will still not be as idiot as to say that they do not belong in Tier 1. That is just clear bias.

In the World of football, there are some facts that everybody accepts regardless of team/player/Country you support or reside in. Real Madrid, Bayern, and Barcelona being the top 3 and in a league of their own is ONE of those things. And when you express an opinion that doesn't sit well with what is already accepted, you are going to be ridiculed. Believe me, I am having difficulty containing myself.

You (or anybody for that matter) saying that Real Madrid does not belong in Tier 1 or the small group of the top top quality clubs is just as bad, if not worse, than Mourinho saying that Hazard is better than Ronaldo.

Well, regardless how flawed your opinion of the current squad might be - mind you it is still the most valuable squad in the World according to transfermarkt ( http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/spieler-statistik/wertvollstemannschaften/marktwertetop ).

The thread is not just about the strength of the squad (though Real has the strongest squad in the World at the moment), it is also about power and respect each club posseses in the world of football. As far as those two variables are concerned, Real Madrid are without a doubt one of the most respected, as well as the most powerful footballing institution on the planet.

Getting back to the squad however, what do you base your opinion on? You've not provided a single reason to back up your opinion so I'm left with assuming that it's either a bias or some kind of a dislike of the club - which by the way should have no bearing on the subject. Considering the manager, we've so far only have seen a few pre-season games to judge how the team will line up and what they have shown have been very positive.

Out of 9 games that we've played, we've only conceded 3 goals. These 9 games have been against: Manchester City, AS Roma, Inter and AC Milan, Tottenham, Bayern Munich, Galatasaray, and the Norway side (can't recall the name). The only game we did lose was against Bayern Munich with a measly score of 1-0. However, it must be mentioned that neither Ronaldo or Benzema played against Bayern. It is not a unreasonable to assume that had they played, we would've won. The total pre-season score is 11 scored, 3 conceded.

In comparison, you look at Barcelona's only last 3 games: one against Sevilla, and two against Athletic Bilbao. They have conceded a total of 9 goals, while only scoring 6. 5 vs Sevilla and 1 vs Bilbao. Their other pre-season games have been just as dismal.

And yet, here you are, saying that Barcelona is a notch higher on the list.

*Shaking my head...

When it comes to ratings such as this one, do not let your emotions get the best of you. Even though I myself detest Barcelona, I will still not be as idiot as to say that they do not belong in Tier 1. That is just clear bias.

In the World of football, there are some facts that everybody accepts regardless of team/player/Country you support or reside in. Real Madrid, Bayern, and Barcelona being the top 3 and in a league of their own is ONE of those things. And when you express an opinion that doesn't sit well with what is already accepted, you are going to be ridiculed. Believe me, I am having difficulty containing myself.

You (or anybody for that matter) saying that Real Madrid does not belong in Tier 1 or the small group of the top top quality clubs is just as bad, if not worse, than Mourinho saying that Hazard is better than Ronaldo.

Well, regardless how flawed your opinion of the current squad might be - mind you it is still the most valuable squad in the World according to transfermarkt ( http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/spieler-statistik/wertvollstemannschaften/marktwertetop ).

The thread is not just about the strength of the squad (though Real has the strongest squad in the World at the moment), it is also about power and respect each club posseses in the world of football. As far as those two variables are concerned, Real Madrid are without a doubt one of the most respected, as well as the most powerful footballing institution on the planet.

Getting back to the squad however, what do you base your opinion on? You've not provided a single reason to back up your opinion so I'm left with assuming that it's either a bias or some kind of a dislike of the club - which by the way should have no bearing on the subject. Considering the manager, we've so far only have seen a few pre-season games to judge how the team will line up and what they have shown have been very positive.

Out of 9 games that we've played, we've only conceded 3 goals. These 9 games have been against: Manchester City, AS Roma, Inter and AC Milan, Tottenham, Bayern Munich, Galatasaray, and the Norway side (can't recall the name). The only game we did lose was against Bayern Munich with a measly score of 1-0. However, it must be mentioned that neither Ronaldo or Benzema played against Bayern. It is not a unreasonable to assume that had they played, we would've won. The total pre-season score is 11 scored, 3 conceded.

In comparison, you look at Barcelona's only last 3 games: one against Sevilla, and two against Athletic Bilbao. They have conceded a total of 9 goals, while only scoring 6. 5 vs Sevilla and 1 vs Bilbao. Their other pre-season games have been just as dismal.

And yet, here you are, saying that Barcelona is a notch higher on the list.

*Shaking my head...

When it comes to ratings such as this one, do not let your emotions get the best of you. Even though I myself detest Barcelona, I will still not be as idiot as to say that they do not belong in Tier 1. That is just clear bias.

In the World of football, there are some facts that everybody accepts regardless of team/player/Country you support or reside in. Real Madrid, Bayern, and Barcelona being the top 3 and in a league of their own is ONE of those things. And when you express an opinion that doesn't sit well with what is already accepted, you are going to be ridiculed. Believe me, I am having difficulty containing myself.

You (or anybody for that matter) saying that Real Madrid does not belong in Tier 1 or the small group of the top top quality clubs is just as bad, than Mourinho saying that Hazard is better than Ronaldo.

@Amerr

While we lost to Bayern without Benzema and Ronaldo, Bayern also didn't play many starters, including Arjen Robben, who would've ran our defense in circles. I think that Bayern are the team to beat this season due to their balance, new additions, and Guardiola being their manager. Madrid still need more work, our offense isn't fluid enough. Although our defensive record has been good in the friendlies, don't take it too seriously. We won't know how well we will perform defensively until we actually start the season.

Barca have a fluid offense but have proved to be leaky in the back recently, but are still a better team than Real, IMO. Obviously Chelsea aren't anywhere near the top 3, especially since they just lost to both Arsenal and City with a combined score of 4-0. I'm actually with @Emrecan here. Madrid are not as good as Barca/Bayern atm, but are still better than the likes of City, PSG, Juve, etc.

Well Amer got some good arguments considering the winning streak ( UNDER ANCELOTTI who is no longer available ), and for Barcelona, both clasico were very balanced, the first one saw Madrid come back to score with a penalty and corner while Barça was very close to score a 0-2, so yes Clasico is won or lost about details...

Secondly, for the league consistence, the Carlo possession Football was incredible vs small teams, less in cups. Now without Ancelotti, Madrid will have much more dificulties to defeat the midtable teams and in term of consistence, if Barça plays their usual Football, the league wont be as close as last year.

Secondly, since Benitez wasnt that wanted by the fans, the smallest crisis and he will be under the biggest pressure he never seen, the president as well.

And well, you are probably talking about the Barça of before February, the one after with a completely adapted Rakitic and Suarez are a little unplayable because they dont need to dominate to win games, Madrid experienced it while they got used to suffer and get the result vs Barça, now even if they dominate they arent sure of winning.

Anyway, if you rate Barça well or not doesnt change the fact that they won all important trophies of last year while they were on rebuilding, Madrid was more stable as a team, now its the opposite, good luck in the second part of the season with Turan and Vidal :) i hope Madrid can get an advantage till January because after this, it will be complicated.