My heart was shattered after today's game. Just shattered.

Is the result of 3-0 defeat marking the end of the 2018-2019 season for Manchester United? Before attempting to answer this question, there are several points I want to be clear.

There are two things I would like to discuss about the players and the coach.
1) People demanded for new players, for replacement of several positions on the field. It certainly is a sensible option. Are the players performing to their level? Are they playing well as a group? Are they playing with freedom and desire? Or are they just playing bad because they are just not good enough? What I saw from today's game is just not one or two players under-perform. It is nearly the team. There are one or two positions that I think the team is severely lacking in depth and quality, but that is not an excuse. That is something we can make up in the next transfer window, and preferably in the summer transfer window. History showed that ManU players bought in winter transfer window usually did not make it for the club. They needed time and games to adapt to the new environment. Hence, basically, if we want to strengthen the squad, we need to to wait until the next summer. Right now, ManU did not have that kind of luxury, so forget all the acquisition of World Class players, we need to focus on what is important right now. The cohesive of the team and the tactical style of ManU. #Cohesive #United #MoreAttackingStyle #YouthPlayers.

Instead of pointing the fingers to this player and that player to say he is sucked or whatever, it maybe time to sit down and reflect, and how to effectively use the players in the best scenarios. And oh, do not forget, ManU do have some very quality, up-and-coming defenders, in the like of Timothy Fosu Mensah, A. Tuanzebe and R. Williams. They have huge potential and given more game time, they will become something special for the club. Utilizing youth players from our academy is always the tradition of ManU, and we are proud of that. #Tradition #FergieKids

So what I am looking for from our players are their reaction to defeat. I am looking for their burning desire to perform, to fight, and to get the result for the club. If a player's heart is no longer at the club, then let him leave even if it grieves us. I am talking about Martial and Pogba, they are great players, one with huge potential and the other is world class. Losing them will be a real hit to any team, but no player is bigger than the team. There is no use in keeping players who do not want to be part of the club. If they still want to play for ManU, they will have to earn it in the training ground and in the upcoming match. #HeartBroken #LetThemLeave #NoPlayerIsBiggerThanTheTeam #Discipline

2) Mourinho - the coach : let's be honest here. we are spending hundreds of millions of dollars in the transfer market in the last few seasons, and according to Mourinho, it is still not a complete squad. Much to the dismay and surprisingly stubborn head of Woodward, things needed to be done are not done. #HugeMoneySpent #Wasteful

What I do not like about Mourinho, is his game style of parking the bus and defensive minded. It may have won us games in certain knockout stage, but that playing style is ugly, and it is not even effective for ManU. Last year's result proved it. Mou playing style is outdated, and the fans absolutely hate it. We know the playing style of ManU is fast attacking style by using classy wingers in the 4-4-2 formation, or the adaptation of 4-3-3 formation. Playing of one-touch soccer and crossing and dribbling has always been ManU forte. It's in our blood and vein. It's in ManU DNA!!! That playing style defines ManU, and no coach or manager is greater than the club! It is just that simple. #DefendIsBoring #Attacking #MoreAttacking #ManUnitedStyle

As much as my dislike for Mou's playing style, I want Mou to stay until the end of this season. People are asking for a change, people are looking for a sack. But the new coach/manger would need time to work with the players, he needs time to make the players familiar with the new tactics and he needs time to understand the players. Everything is taking time, and we do not have that kind of luxury either. We can talk and discuss about the change of management, when this season coming to an end, which I do think we need a new manager, who is more suitable for the club.

So, what do we do now? All hope seems lost? The answer is NO.
We need to find a short term solution for both the players and the coach. ManU needs to play every single game with the utmost desire to win. We need to treat every single game as if it is a cup final. The team (with us fans supporting) need to fight for the result. The team need to fight for every single ball. The coach needs to keep his head up and keeps the team morale high. He needs to let the team know, they are not just playing regular games, they are playing for the fans, they are playing for the pride of ManU, to show how good they are, to show how ManU are made of!!! What I am looking for from the team and the coach is their reaction, instant reaction! #Fight #EveryGameIsAFight #NeverBackDown

The result from the loss against Spurs is bad, but there is some slimmer of hope. At least, I saw a much more attacking oriented ManU, I saw how Mou ordered the team to press high up, and attempt more attacking soccer. Yes, we lose, but that is not the end. I do hope for a bounce back in the next week's game. Result in the next game will not matter to me, but the reaction from the players and the coach would be crucial. As a truly and loyal ManU fan, I will stick and support the team with all my heart. You guys won't hear any more complain about the coach or pointing the fingers at any players. We won't need that kind of reaction (from the fans). We need to show more faith in the team, and support, and give them will to fight. I believe in the team. And let's ManU keep going. #ManUNeedMoreSupport #LoyalFan #FightingSpirit

AT THE END OF THE TUNNEL, THERE IS ALWAYS LIGHT.

Thanks guys for reading this, and let me know your opinion.

GameOn #Fight #MoreFight #ManUnited

@trimind: I agree with everything you said.

Only I want to add, Mou did achieve something for MU, something the 2 previous coaches couldn't. But it's FAR FAR from enough, and it doesn't look like he's going to gain more if this situation stays. He needs to change.

FAR FAR from enough

What will be enough?

Liverpool hasn't won the league for last 28 years or anything worthy since 2005. Arsenal has fallen out of top 4. Chelsea gets one season king and other mediocre without any stability in any of them. Spurs are trying and will die trying along with their hopes of winning anything. City spends like maniac and wins. Are you ready to spend like City? Spend it and win the league.

I doubt anyone other than Chelsea, or City will win the league this year. Liverpool doesn't have the mental stamina to go extra mile. I still think United has a shot at the title. It is so early in the season.

Let me ask you this question: do you seriously think McTominay is better than Pereira or Timothy Fosu Mensah?

I think that if you make into the lineup, you're better. Potential is an abstract concept that is so rarely ever fulfilled. You judge players on what they can do, and McTominay has proved that he can.

Back to the point of Mou keeping young players in the team, did you see Mou giving any chance to youth players in Chelsea? I mean, Chelsea have produced loads of top young talents in their academy, and look where they are now? None in the starting line-up back when Mou is in charge. He's never trust young players and he never will.

Not without merit, but then you say this:

What Mou achieved in the past with Chelsea has nothing to do here.

So you keep all the negatives from his time at Chelsea and ignore all of the positives. Pardon if me if I find that deplorable for both argumentation and my estimation of your opinion.

And if you are even following the games, where Fosu-Mensah and Tuanzebe are on loan, you will see how good they really are. Both are extremely comfortable on the ball, good passing, excellent positioning and defending skills. They are ready for games in top level.

I cannot speak for Tuanzebe, but I can for Fosu-Mensah, as I watched many Palace games last season. He got benched towards the middle of the season by a player even younger than himself. If he cannot crack Palace's lineup, what hope does he have for ours?

If you ask me right now, what is the ManU defense I am looking for, I will tell you I will field Shaw, Smalling/Jones/Baily, Tuanzebe and Fosu-Mensah. These are the guys who are giving 100% for ManU's shirt, they will fight for the coach if he shows faith in them. But look at where they are now, both Tuanzebe and Fosu-Mensah sent on loan, whilst we still keep the old Ashley Young and Damien.

I'm all for giving young players a chance, but this has no basis in reality. None of these players would give more for United than Smalling or Young, who have been doing that on a weekly basis for over half a decade. You're still operating in the world of potential, and for a club of United's level, potential doesn't matter, NOW matters. And if you want any better evidence of that, look at the reactions to 2 losses in a row. No one gives two shits how good these players may be in the future, they want to win games. Now. Anything else in unacceptable.

Does Pogba worth the $100M tag?

Based off of his track record and world cup performances, I think you'd have a hard time convincing anyone otherwise.

I suppose you have been a life-long ManU fan. And I think you gotta know about ManU tradition and everything. I have followed ManU for more than 20 years, and I know what I am talking about. Result isn't everything. ManU used to lost against AcMilan 3-0 in the CL, and we lost both finals against Barca. We got knocked out by RealMadrid, when Nani getting sent off. I remembered all those things, and even when we are lost, no fans are complaining

I have not followed United for 20 years. I first began to watch this sport in 2006. That said, "no fans are complaining" is hilariously revisionist history. There was trust in the manager, but there was zero trust in the ownership, lack of trust in nearly all of the players save Ronaldo/Rooney/Ferdinand/Vidic. Nowadays we remember players like Park and Carrick as heroes, they were treated no better than Herrera is now. Ditto Evra, I remember when he came into the team and was awful, fans complained about him every game. They questioned the tactics when we got run over by Pep's Barca, and they wanted rebuilds of premier-league winning sides because of poor UCL form. You have completely re-written history if you think there were no fans complaining.

You are desperately trying to defend Mou for his outdated and ugly defensive style, just to get a few results. Tell me what do you see last season. After both legs against Valencia, do you think ManU deserve anything? Is Valencia the stronger team with better players? We were shocking in both games. I have never seen a worse ManU game in my life before. When you are the better team, with better players, playing in home ground, you play defensive, anti-soccer style? Is that how you are supposed to win games? These things just show how Mou is just not fit to be a ManU coach.

Desperately is a strong word for it, and I resent its use. Besides, we lost to Sevilla, not Valencia, and it's disappointing that you cannot even get that right. Use your head more, and your heart a bit less, it's leading you wrong here.

There is no such thing as an anti-soccer style. This is sheer bull perpetuated by people who don't understand the game and just want to see the net bulge, and once again, I'm disappointed that you see it that way. In case you had not noticed, we won more games last season than we have in any other season post-Fergie. That's more games won than any other in the past 5 years. I ask you to stop living in the far past, and look to the more recent history, on which last season was a tremendous improvement. But we still didn't win anything, and so we still needed to improve.

The board did not take the steps to ensure that improvement. If they thought as you do, they should have just fired Mou. If they thought as I do, they should have supported him. They did neither, and put Mou into a situation where he likely will not succeed, probably by design. This is the real problem, and again, I'm disappointed that you don't appear to realize that.

And at least I do prefer the way Mou allowed the team to go forward and attack in Spurs game, much better than the game against Brighton. It is a one off result, and if Mou changes his mentality, the result will come sooner than later, given the players fighting for him.

So when Mou grinds out wins for 2 whole seasons and loses to Brighton, it's a damning indictment, but when he plays one game the way your brand of fans wants, and loses 3-0, it's a one-off. I'll let you figure out on your own how ridiculous that sounds.

I rate games based on what I saw, not on what people tell me, or some "winning 3 PL cup" in the past.

This statement is why we're disagreeing, and why you will never even comprehend my perspective. So again, I'm sorry for your close-mindedness.

Marcus2011

Check again. We even had entire thread dedicated to this. Also, truth of the matter is that if Mourinho leaves this season next manager will come and will buy CB's plus some additional players. 100% guarantee!

I'm gonna use FootyRoom's center for this:

Stones- 47.5
Walker- 50
Danilo- 26.5
Mendy- 49.2
Laporte- 57
Ederson ( I don't know if this count but let's just do it) - 35
Bravo- 15.4

This adds to 230.2 million, but 280 if the goalkeepers are included. I don't know where you got 448 million from
mate.

Yes, additional player to a team that has Sane on the bench! Also did he come cheap? No.

Not cheap, but considering Bernardo Silva is likely to play more in the middle, someone has to cover or replace Sane/Sterling when they get injured. A smart buy considering he is also a great player and once got PFA player of the year.

Let's not turn this into City topic but mate don't pull the cat by its tail. Guardiola has spent a lot. It is all recorded on files available on google with click of a button. Don't think, just look it up.

True let's not go too off topic, but I did my research.

Money is the factor. EPL clubs have a lot of it so they will always get at least 50% add on transfer fee for some bs reasons on top of the actual value for the player..

I believe Emery has shown it is possible to work within a budget. Pochettino too, and I suppose Klopp before this season.

Bottom line: Mourinho is not up to his standards. He deserves the blame but he can't be the only one to be blamed. He set up the team good like it was mentioned above but team couldn't score out of so many chances. Should he get on the pitch and shoot those chances too? Spurs were shut down in first half. Top club should have finished those chances in the first half then locked the game but even if they couldn't score they shouldn't have conceded so many goals in one half from a team that wasn't playing better football. If it was by one goal, i would have said ok bad game plan but by 3 ! Players need to be hold responsible.

Agreed, the Lukaku miss did certainly change the game. You have to take those chances in big games, and I don't see Lukaku as a big game player.

I remember from bio of Frank Lampard that he used to practice extra after the game when he didn't finish chances or had a bad game. Where is this sort of attitude? Why that douchebag self loving Lukaku doesn't stay after the game and practice his touch! His touch is so awful that i often wonder how is he playing pro and i am the one commenting! And people used to compare him to Drogba !! hahha give me a break!! Drogba used to score out of nothing literally out of nothing!

Agreed again

'm gonna use FootyRoom's center for this:

Don't use footyroom :D

Hahah man, you really wanted me to the counting? Seriously? Maybe, you just don't know where to look but I will do the counting for you. Please, do good researches not convenient ones like going into footyroom.

In the years between 2016 and 2018 Guardiola has spent 807.7 million euro ( that is expenses) go to transfermarket ( legit source) and see what he sold for yourself. The team is packed!! lol please, any manager's dream budget! It is like real life FIFA manager mode!

Emery has shown it is possible to work within a budget.

You have lots of faith into low budget seasons. Good luck! You are just walking the same path that you did with Wenger but now with Emery ;)

Pochetino won't win anything. They can compete for top 4 and will but not for title. Just obstacle.

Klopp ehh maybe but in the long run, i don't know if they have enough discipline within the team. Now give him the budget that Guardiola got then definitely big contender. Give that budget to Mourinho who supposedly spent too much but didn't win anything. I guess winning European cup title and Micky mouse cup don't count for much which i bet Pochetino and Klopp wouldn't mind to win.

Marcus2011

In the years between 2016 and 2018 Guardiola has spent 807.7 million euro ( that is expenses) go to transfermarket ( legit source) and see what he sold for yourself. The team is packed!! lol please, any manager's dream budget! It is like real life FIFA manager mode!

192.15+285.15+64.07 adds to 541.97. This is around 604 million euros. I agree it's still a lot of money regardless, but it's pretty worth it considering they just won the league, and look firm favourites to win it again. A lot of those players are long term players too, so it's a win for City.

You have lots of faith into low budget seasons. Good luck! You are just walking the same path that you did with Wenger but now with Emery ;)

Well, I'm not saying we can win the league yet, but top 4 + a trophy is a decent achievement to me.

Give that budget to Mourinho who supposedly spent too much but didn't win anything. I guess winning European cup title and Micky mouse cup don't count for much which i bet Pochetino and Klopp wouldn't mind to win.

Well, we did get to the final of the League Cup and the semi final of the EL. Considering we had a worse team last year, I think that getting those trophies with a lower budget is a bigger acheivement than what Mourinho did in his first season :)

I think United got the quality and everything right except the manager. I don't think anyone is happy with the way Man. United are playing.

@amir

92.15+285.15+64.07 adds to 541.97. This is around 604 million euros. I agree it's still a lot of money regardless, but it's pretty worth it
considering they just won the league, and look firm favourites to win
it again. A lot of those players are long term players too, so it's a
win for City.

Come on, don't beat around the bush. Arsneal fans having giving us so much crap for so many years for spending so much or always marginalizing Mourinho's achievements but now you are being understanding of the amount that has been spent by Guardiola? Fact is that man has spend way more than anyone did ever in such a short period of time and he has spend on the players he wanted not anyone else. In United people keep pocking the amount Mourinho has spent during same time, during which his two most expensive transfers, Pogba and Lukaku, make the majority of the expense and were most likely projects that were thrown not by Mourinho.

Absolute control of the transfer and budget is given to Pep so he produces the football that he dreams by bringing players that can make those tactics work. After spending so much money to have a such a depth and quality in the squad ( amazing depth) winning the league is AUTOMATIC and winning the CHAMPIONS LEAGUE is the MINIMUM PRIMARY objective on which his job will be evaluated this year. Simple.

Honestly, City board doesn't care if those players are there for long time or short time. They care if they will win CL for them otherwise they will refresh the squad and the manager to try again. Model of CIty for the past 7 years. Well, we at Chelsea are also sort of guilty of this not in this magnitude thought but still i am trying to be careful with what I say :))

top 4 + a trophy is a decent achievement to me

So pretty much Wenger hasn't left Arsenal. He reincarnated himself into Emery.

Well, we did get to the final of the League Cup and the semi final of the EL. Considering we had a worse team last year,

And why didn't you win? No, one cares about participant in the final. History is written by victors.

How can people still believe it is not Mourinho's fault?
In the press conference he was bragging about how offensive the team was.. The guy is dillusional. And that statement clearly shows what we can expect the most offensive football to be for United. I believe what we saw vs Tottenham is the most offensive we'll ever see United play under this management.

Another question to think about.. Could the lack of transfers this past summer be due to players not wanting to join a team managed by Mourinho?

Im sure Mourinho has very clear indications not to mention his obvious disappointment with the transfers United couldnt complete. You can see it in his eyes every press conference. But United is not Chelsea, they won't let Mou bash on the upper management of the club like that, but is he directly responsible for this atrocious summer window?

Sorry for the scattered arguments..

Another point I wanted to make is that claiming Mourinho (or United) has no quality players to work with is just BS. This same squad had a fantastic defense last couple of seasons, you can't argue that we concede goals because our defenders are just not good enough when the previous couple seasons the defensive line as a whole has been very decent, props to Mou for that. These same players are just getting better individually, they are young and can only grow as top players from this point on.
Just saying, if you keep the same players and they tend to perform worst season after season under the same manager without clear evidence of poor individual performance... it might be the manager's fault.

United is a trainwreck now, and just because its Mou who is sitting at the top of the management you have to consider that maybe the players or the dressing room in general are done with him.

United doesn't have a team (quality and depth) to win the PL let alone the CL but it most definitely has a team capable of bigger things than what we've achieved this past 3 years.

winning the league is automatic lol, how? leicester city wins the league and everyone predicted it before? no matter how much you spend there are still ways to make stupid decisions and gameplan. real madrid managers changed from pellegrini to mou to ancelotti to benitez to zidane until they are satisfied with 3 straight ucl trophies. similarly, I understand man utd fans such as tuan and tuanis are not satisfied yet until it's back to fergie days again. Anyway, I don't want to constantly blame mourinho again because players like lukaku and lindelof also needs to stop hiding behind pogba. lol, everytime man utd lose the conversation is either pogba or mou, it's getting boring in circles :|

Marcus2011

Come on, don't beat around the bush. Arsneal fans having giving us so much crap for so many years for spending so much or always marginalizing Mourinho's achievements but now you are being understanding of the amount that has been spent by Guardiola? Fact is that man has spend way more than anyone did ever in such a short period of time and he has spend on the players he wanted not anyone else.

People marginalized Mourinho's success because the guy talks so much. Pep doesn't come out and say this guy is spending so much. Mou called out rivals by saying they are buying the titles. Well guess who spent 1 billion first? Mourinho. Who bought titles in 2005 and 2006? Mourinho.

I'm not hating him for that, but this guy is quite a hypocrite if he is going to hate on people for something he used to do.

Absolute control of the transfer and budget is given to Pep so he produces the football that he dreams by bringing players that can make those tactics work. After spending so much money to have a such a depth and quality in the squad ( amazing depth) winning the league is AUTOMATIC and winning the CHAMPIONS LEAGUE is the MINIMUM PRIMARY objective on which his job will be evaluated this year. Simple.

Winning the CL is always City's goal, again I don't think they will get it though. Maybe in 2/3 years we can actually evaulate them. No rush for them to me. Pep won't get sacked if he walks the League as you say.

Honestly, City board doesn't care if those players are there for long time or short time. They care if they will win CL for them otherwise they will refresh the squad and the manager to try again. Model of CIty for the past 7 years. Well, we at Chelsea are also sort of guilty of this not in this magnitude thought but still i am trying to be careful with what I say :))

Now with Pep's management, I doubt that. Pep doesn't seem to be leaving anytime soon either.

So pretty much Wenger hasn't left Arsenal. He reincarnated himself into Emery.

LOL, but to be honest we aren't the 4th best team in England at this moment in time. If we can punch above our weight with Emery, amazing. Slowly build that great team, and hopefully win the League within 5 years, depending on how things go.

And why didn't you win? No, one cares about participant in the final. History is written by victors.

Well, this may be the year :) No reason to not be optimistic, Emery is one of the best managers at cups IMO, arguably best in the League. I might be baised, but his acheivements with Sevilla are amazing.

Well guess who spent 1 billion first? Mourinho. Who bought titles in 2005 and 2006? Mourinho.

Again. No facts. You are just throwing words around. We had good investment into the team, yes but not 1 billion.. that is crazy.

this guy is quite a hypocrite if he is going to hate on people for something he used to do.

No, he is ahead of the curve. It is fans like yourself and media who are hypocrites with short memory. Everyone spends now but it became normality, yet no one gets or ever got anywhere near as much as bashing as Mourinho and Chelsea. So the old man is bitter for unfair treatment. I would do too. He only plays the same game like Media does which stir the pot of crap. Man do you know how press conference works? Media asks question and he answers ( HE IS OBLIGATED) he may say less or more but media feeds on that info. Talks too much is exactly what media wants. It is an entertainment not White House press conference although that is also entertainment lately.

I used to think Fergie was the biggest hypocrite during his interviews but then i realized that the man is clever with what he says and merely gets back at anyone whenever and however he wants. I am sorry that Wenger was too simple minded with media. He never was good with press talks against anyone but let it go. I accept that Mourinho can be an a8ss hole but so do everyone to him.

No one does something out of nothing just for the sake of doing it. For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction.

Winning the CL is always City's goal, again I don't think they will
get it though. Maybe in 2/3 years we can actually evaulate them. No
rush for them to me. Pep won't get sacked if he walks the League as
you say.

Nah, team was build to dominate CL not the league. Pep will get sacked if he doesn't win the CL. Not winning the league with this squad will be a failure already. When was the last time a team won back to back? Yes this year it may happen.

Pep doesn't seem to be leaving anytime soon either.

Do you have him on speed dial? Did he seem like leaving during his time at Barcelona and Bayern?

Slowly build that great team, and hopefully win the League within 5
years, depending on how things go.

Mark my words Emery won't last. And I highly doubt that Arsenal will win the league in 5 years when Kroenke got the full control of the club.

Well, this may be the year :) No reason to not be optimistic, Emery is
one of the best managers at cups IMO, arguably best in the League. I
might be baised, but his acheivements with Sevilla are amazing.

My friend, I like your naive optimism. He didn't win European cup with PSG squad that is packed with world class players and you expect him to win with Arsenal that still hasn't fixed squads main problems: Like having a proper DEFENSE that can at least keep a clean sheet for more than one game.

There are a lot of solid points in this thread but at the end of the day, we are three games into the season. THREE GAMES! Try being a QPR fan or a Newcastle fan! haha

I do agree that the players are speaking volumes in how they are reacting to these matches. I am not expecting tears or anything, but they seem disinterested.

Lots of games left gents, no way do I give up easy.

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I think that if you make into the lineup, you're better. Potential is an abstract concept that is so rarely ever fulfilled. You judge players on what they can do, and McTominay has proved that he can.

That's pretty funny argument that you have. Let's make a quick question to ManU fans about who do they think is better, McTominay or Pereira and Timothy-Fosuh Mensah.

I am not even talking about potential mate, I am talking about the player's quality. Check the stats yourself between Pereira and McTominay (based on gamestats last season when Pereira on loan at Valencia and McTominay at ManU, or further stats in the last couple seasons). That is all I need to say. The stats speak for itself.

McTominay is not proven at all really, he is chosen by Mou simply because he suits his philosophy (ugly one on top of that), to sit, defend and harass the opponents due to his strength and height. He offers literally nothing going forward, he can't dribble, he can't make difficult pass, and he is not even that good defending. He is a younger version of Fellaini, that's what I saw when McTominay playing.

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So you keep all the negatives from his time at Chelsea and ignore all of the positives. Pardon if me if I find that deplorable for both argumentation and my estimation of your opinion.

Oh and please correct me if I am wrong. Why are all Chelsea fans dislike Mou, even after all his "success" at the club?
You clearly stated in the previous comments that you will only judge a manager based on the current state. Then how is 2 games lost out of 3, conceding 7 f**** goals sound to you? I would assume you would chuckle and say that is ACCEPTABLE ? And Mou is not at fault? Well knowing you full well, I would have imagined you saying that. That just speaks volume about you and your character.

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I cannot speak for Tuanzebe, but I can for Fosu-Mensah, as I watched many Palace games last season. He got benched towards the middle of the season by a player even younger than himself. If he cannot crack Palace's lineup, what hope does he have for ours?

Interesting, so now you can just go watch Fulham playing, and see for yourself about Fosu-Mensah. He is literally the best fullback at Fulham right now, a class above the other defenders. It's also very funny, when your idea and Mou's idea aligned with each other. There is no doubt that you would defend "your Idolizer Mou" to the last breath.

And Fosu-Mensah can't crack the Palace line up you say? At least check the stats for the whole seasons then. Don't just look at it from one angle, but at broader angle please. Young players are sometimes inconsistant, or they can get injuries, and you look at the last few games and say Fosu-Mensah is not good "lol" . That's very rich coming from you.

And TYI, Fosu-Mensah benched Ryan Sessegnon in the last few games at Fulham, who is himself considered one of the brightest and most promising youth fullbacks at PL.

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I'm all for giving young players a chance, but this has no basis in reality. None of these players would give more for United than Smalling or Young, who have been doing that on a weekly basis for over half a decade. You're still operating in the world of potential, and for a club of United's level, potential doesn't matter, NOW matters. And if you want any better evidence of that, look at the reactions to 2 losses in a row. No one gives two shits how good these players may be in the future, they want to win games. Now. Anything else in unacceptable.

Ha, looks who's talking here? All for giving young players a chance? That's such a cliche. You bashing our young players from start to finish, and then suddenly says that. At least you should try harder next time. Hypocrites to the core. I remember Mou claimed that he is giving youth players the most chance in Chelsea, better than any other managers, and now we hear the same thing from you. That's just rich, very rich.

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Based off of his track record and world cup performances, I think you'd have a hard time convincing anyone otherwise.

And with the way he performed on the pitch for ManU. Do you still think it's not his fault? Arguebly, it's not entirely his fault, but who else, if not because of Mou?

Pogba could worth that much, if he consistently fought for the shirt, and performed regularly for the team, which he didn't. He played one great game, and then slumped the next two games.

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That said, "no fans are complaining" is hilariously revisionist history. There was trust in the manager, but there was zero trust in the ownership, lack of trust in nearly all of the players save Ronaldo/Rooney/Ferdinand/Vidic.

Oh please, you can just go ask all of the ManU fans here about it. Yes, there might be one or two complains. But not to the extent of most ManU fans who want their manager to be SACKED. That's insane and unheard of from ManU fans. And even after the departure of Ronaldo, ManU still performed strongly. And if you compare the players in 2012 to the current ManU squad, this current squad is, in some areas, stronger. Yet, we are still under-performed vastly, with a much more ugly playing style, and no youth players having a chance to break into the first time. It's basically going against all of ManU traditions and philosophy!!!

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Desperately is a strong word for it, and I resent its use. Besides, we lost to Seville, not Valencia, and it's disappointing that you cannot even get that right. Use your head more, and your heart a bit less, it's leading you wrong here.

Well I admit it is a typo. Either way, Seville and Valencia are about at the same level. Losing to Seville or Valencia, in the way we lost last season, is just shameful. And no disrespect intended to Seville or Valencia.

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There is no such thing as an anti-soccer style. This is sheer bull perpetuated by people who don't understand the game and just want to see the net bulge, and once again, I'm disappointed that you see it that way. In case you had not noticed, we won more games last season than we have in any other season post-Fergie. That's more games won than any other in the past 5 years. I ask you to stop living in the far past, and look to the more recent history, on which last season was a tremendous improvement. But we still didn't win anything, and so we still needed to improve.

Funny, if you just google or look it up, and you will figure out yourself. It's not that hard actually.

Defending passively and 'park the bus' is different from counter-attacking soccer mate. And talking about living in the past, it is you and Mou's fans delusional in the playing style. It is already in the past, and now the current trend is attacking with different attacking style. Some likes to control with quick short passing (Pep/Barca's style), the other likes to press high with great fatality counter-attacking (Klopp and Pochetino), the other likes to have more control and more direct pass (Sarri). And Emergy with his wingbacks play and high tempo game and further press upwards. All these teams made us look bad enough with the result, and the playing style is even worse.

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The board did not take the steps to ensure that improvement. If they thought as you do, they should have just fired Mou. If they thought as I do, they should have supported him. They did neither, and put Mou into a situation where he likely will not succeed, probably by design. This is the real problem, and again, I'm disappointed that you don't appear to realize that.

Well, at least this is the only thing that I would agree with you. And I am not all about firing Mou tbh. If Mou makes amend and change, then he can still be ManU manager. What I am looking for is his reaction to defeat, and stop go boasting on the news and go on and on about how great he was. No one really cared.

And there is some slight hope of change, as he visited the U23 ManU game few days ago. There is some hope that he might look into the U23, and see for himself if he can utilize any players from that team. There are a few guys, who I am very impressed in the name of Angel Gomez, Tatith Chong, .R. Williams and the new signings Diogo Dalot. The problem about Mou is he absolutely hates risks. It prevents him from going forward and attack.

That's pretty funny argument that you have. Let's make a quick question to ManU fans about who do they think is better, McTominay or Pereira and Timothy-Fosuh Mensah.
I am not even talking about potential mate, I am talking about the player's quality. Check the stats yourself between Pereira and McTominay (based on gamestats last season when Pereira on loan at Valencia and McTominay at ManU, or further stats in the last couple seasons). That is all I need to say. The stats speak for itself.

Tbh, if you want the fastest way to find an opinion that's totally wrong, ask the fans. You'd think the ArsenalFanTV's of the world would have mad that obvious, or obnoxious twitter replies, but the gist is that the vast majority of fans have no idea what they're talking about.

You're asking me to compare the stats between Periera and McTominay. Considering one was playing as a winger and the other as a CDM, this is not particularly relevant. However, it could be argued that Periera is starting above McTominay now. As I said before, if you make it into the lineup, you're better. So fair enough.

Oh and please correct me if I am wrong. Why are all Chelsea fans dislike Mou, even after all his "success" at the club?
You clearly stated in the previous comments that you will only judge a manager based on the current state. Then how is 2 games lost out of 3, conceding 7 f**** goals sound to you? I would assume you would chuckle and say that is ACCEPTABLE ? And Mou is not at fault? Well knowing you full well, I would have imagined you saying that. That just speaks volume about you and your character.

Most Chelsea fans do like Mou. I would try not to let internet trolls lead you astray on this one. As for the rest, you misread my post, and then began to insult me instead of my points. You'll have to forgive me for not bothering to form a response as a result.

Interesting, so now you can just go watch Fulham playing, and see for yourself about Fosu-Mensah. He is literally the best fullback at Fulham right now, a class above the other defenders. It's also very funny, when your idea and Mou's idea aligned with each other. There is no doubt that you would defend "your Idolizer Mou" to the last breath.
And Fosu-Mensah can't crack the Palace line up you say? At least check the stats for the whole seasons then. Don't just look at it from one angle, but at broader angle please. Young players are sometimes inconsistant, or they can get injuries, and you look at the last few games and say Fosu-Mensah is not good "lol" . That's very rich coming from you.
And TYI, Fosu-Mensah benched Ryan Sessegnon in the last few games at Fulham, who is himself considered one of the brightest and most promising youth fullbacks at PL.

I didn't watch the Fulham game today, as I was watching other fixtures, but given how you've managed to mis-represent every loan player so far you'll forgive me if I don't take your word for it. And Mou is hardly my idol, which you would manage to figure out if you've actually read anything I've written so far...

What I said about Fosu-Mensah is true. He started about half the season (while Palace were literally bottom of the league) and got dropped, after which their form picked up. I'm not saying he was the sole reason for their poor form (far from it) but it is irresponsible to just say that he started half the season for the worst side in the division and so he deserves to start for us.

As for the point about Sessegnon, I hope you understand that he's been playing as a left winger for the past 10 months. Him being on the bench today had nothing to do with Fosu-Mensah.

Ha, looks who's talking here? All for giving young players a chance? That's such a cliche. You bashing our young players from start to finish, and then suddenly says that. At least you should try harder next time. Hypocrites to the core. I remember Mou claimed that he is giving youth players the most chance in Chelsea, better than any other managers, and now we hear the same thing from you. That's just rich, very rich.

I don't understand your meaning. I stated that a) if young players are better than existing players than they should start, or b) if they are comparable they should be given a chance. I do not believe the individuals that you are highlighting meet either of these qualities, and clearly everyone else at the club agrees, which is why most of them are out on loan. I don't see how that makes me a hypocrite, and I certainly don't see what Mou has to do with my allegedly being a hypocrite.

Not even going to bother to talk about Pogba because nothing meaningful was said.

Oh please, you can just go ask all of the ManU fans here about it. Yes, there might be one or two complains. But not to the extent of most ManU fans who want their manager to be SACKED. That's insane and unheard of from ManU fans. And even after the departure of Ronaldo, ManU still performed strongly. And if you compare the players in 2012 to the current ManU squad, this current squad is, in some areas, stronger. Yet, we are still under-performed vastly, with a much more ugly playing style, and no youth players having a chance to break into the first time. It's basically going against all of ManU traditions and philosophy!!!

Because Sir Alex was the greatest manager of all time and everyone knew that. It would be like Barca fans complaining about Messi. There would be no basis in reality. Of course, they could and did complain about literally everything else. The internet was not the main forum for it then, so it went more under the radar, but I recall pundits and the like bashing United for everything from complacency to penny-pinching to losing touch with their roots when we bought players for big fees. The internet has let anyone with a device complain to everyone, so it's more viable now, but it was always there.

Defending passively and 'park the bus' is different from counter-attacking soccer mate. And talking about living in the past, it is you and Mou's fans delusional in the playing style. It is already in the past, and now the current trend is attacking with different attacking style. Some likes to control with quick short passing (Pep/Barca's style), the other likes to press high with great fatality counter-attacking (Klopp and Pochetino), the other likes to have more control and more direct pass (Sarri). And Emergy with his wingbacks play and high tempo game and further press upwards. All these teams made us look bad enough with the result, and the playing style is even worse.

It's still soccer. It's not anti-soccer, jesus. Atletico play defensive. So did Inter when they won the UCL. Ditto Chelsea for nearly a decade. It's not attacking, but that doesn't mean it isn't soccer. Pointing out how other teams attack doesn't change that, so I'm confused as to what you're attempting to prove???

Well, at least this is the only thing that I would agree with you. And I am not all about firing Mou tbh. If Mou makes amend and change, then he can still be ManU manager. What I am looking for is his reaction to defeat, and stop go boasting on the news and go on and on about how great he was. No one really cared.

Amusingly, this is my point of disagreement. If the board wants to play attacking soccer, they should 100% fire Mou right now. I don't think you try to force a defensive manager to use an attacking system. Square peg, round hole.

And there is some slight hope of change, as he visited the U23 ManU game few days ago. There is some hope that he might look into the U23, and see for himself if he can utilize any players from that team. There are a few guys, who I am very impressed in the name of Angel Gomez, Tatith Chong, .R. Williams and the new signings Diogo Dalot. The problem about Mou is he absolutely hates risks. It prevents him from going forward and attack

I saw he was there. General speculation is that he was there to see Dalot, who might start in upcoming league fixtures, which seems to me the most likely scenario.

Marcus2011

Again. No facts. You are just throwing words around. We had good investment into the team, yes but not 1 billion.. that is crazy.

Well, it is a fact. I wasn't only referring to his spell at Chelsea, rather his career.

http://dailypost.ng/2017/08/06/mourinho-becomes-first-manager-football-history-spend-1billion-transfers/

No, he is ahead of the curve. It is fans like yourself and media who are hypocrites with short memory. Everyone spends now but it became normality, yet no one gets or ever got anywhere near as much as bashing as Mourinho and Chelsea. So the old man is bitter for unfair treatment. I would do too. He only plays the same game like Media does which stir the pot of crap. Man do you know how press conference works? Media asks question and he answers ( HE IS OBLIGATED) he may say less or more but media feeds on that info. Talks too much is exactly what media wants. It is an entertainment not White House press conference although that is also entertainment lately.

That's because he started talking nonsense about rivals like Klopp and Pep. A trend he and Roman basically started. I would understand if Eddie Howe or Sean Dyche or Chris Hughton complained, but Mourinho? No wonder he is bitter, maybe he should focus on himself and how to improve his management skills, instead of looking at his rivals. His man management skills are woeful in truth, he always carries this agenda and has to pick fights with players for no reason. Can you tell me why Bastian a legendary CM would just start on him. Nah it's just not possible.

And you say media asks him question and he answers. He was asked about the defeat, and he said I have more titles than everyone combined. And here I used to complain about Wenger lol. Imagine a United fan's reaction, there are already some pissed off people on this thread alone.

I accept that Mourinho can be an a8ss hole but so do everyone to him.

If your an asshole to someone, you can expect it back.

Nah, team was build to dominate CL not the league. Pep will get sacked if he doesn't win the CL. Not winning the league with this squad will be a failure already. When was the last time a team won back to back? Yes this year it may happen.

With the way the team is playing and the morale and motivation of players, I highly doubt that Pep will get sacked. Who would do better than him that is available? I can't see a better man for the job currently.

Do you have him on speed dial? Did he seem like leaving during his time at Barcelona and Bayern?

He just signed a deal until 2021, and this guy has always fufiled his contracts. He may get sacked, but he will very likely not walk before 2021.

Mark my words Emery won't last. And I highly doubt that Arsenal will win the league in 5 years when Kroenke got the full control of the club.

You never know, something special can happen :) I hope Emery stays for longer than 5 years if this go well.

My friend, I like your naive optimism. He didn't win European cup with PSG squad that is packed with world class players and you expect him to win with Arsenal that still hasn't fixed squads main problems: Like having a proper DEFENSE that can at least keep a clean sheet for more than one game.

He got 2 of the biggest teams in the world, remember that. I don't think he is a top top coach for the biggest teams, but he is a great manager to take over and continue Wenger's legacy. Hopefully we get that clean sheet tommorow.

Well, it is a fact. I wasn't only referring to his spell at Chelsea,
rather his career.

Yes mate OVER HIS CAREER TIME, Not in 3 seasons because that is where Pep is heading if he spends further. On the very edge.

I would suggest for you to look up his net spend as well though. It will surprise you.

A trend he and Roman basically started

Roman Started it but Mourinho just turned into success. Otherwise, how else did you expect a club that was on the brink of bankruptcy to win titles during the era of total domination by Arsenal and Manchester United? Yes, Roman spent a lot since 2003 but he didn't nearly exaggerate as our Gulf friends who has outdone him in spending in just a couple of seasons. Only reason why it stuck with Mourinho because people always trying to hate on anyone who has made an amazing achievement with Chelsea setting records in his first season and going almost unbeaten with only one unfair loss.

Yet, people forget his previous achievements like that he won treble with Porto.. people forget that even though during that time it was big sum ( apparently) spend on the team, it was Mourinho who made that team work well and dominate ( Madrid used to spend just as much and still struggled to win la liga) .. people forget that Chelseas team was playing against very dominant sides like Arsenals golden generation who just ended their unbeaten run and Manhcester United who were both flying high!

Mourinho came and he did exactly what he said he would do! It is like being thrown into the cage with two lions and come out stronger lion yourself. That is why i think pundits are full of sh8t and often talk out of their a8ss by disrespecting him showing him as mediocre. They would dream to achieve a quarter of what he achieved during his career. Only ones I gave just a bit of respect is Neville and Carragher, others always talk non sense because they were non sense professionals themselves or never had a football IQ higher than average football fan.

No wonder he is bitter, maybe he should focus on himself and how to improve his management skills, instead of looking at his rivals

I agree. He definitely should improve his management skills but who am i to tell him that or what credibility do pundits or media have when he is the one making millions for himself and for them so they have something to talk about while he is managing top football clubs?

I do feel mixed about his tactics as they aren't working out as they used to anymore. So, maybe a time away will do him good, although i hope he stays in EPL because he brings excitement into the league. Other than Klopp we have some boring managers who doesn't bring anything fun into press conference or during the game. Again, this game is about entertainment and Mou brings ratings up, hate him or love him. Any publicity is always good publicity. I am sure United won't mind either as longest he wins and apparently with beautiful style as they are nostalgic still about old days.

If your an asshole to someone, you can expect it back.

Exactly. It is two way highway.

With the way the team is playing and the morale and motivation of
players, I highly doubt that Pep will get sacked. Who would do better
than him that is available? I can't see a better man for the job
currently.

Sure, but his job is not win EPL titles with this team. Sheikh spent money to make monster team to dominate CL and again EPL is expected to be dominated with such a team. If Pep can't make City CL champions, then there is always another manager... for example Zidane ;) Zidane wins CL and did it 3 times. Unlike Pep who won it on the back of the controversial referee decisions both in 2009 and 2011 ( I think Arsenal was also one of the victim teams with Persie incident) campaigns. Pep is a great league manager not sure about knock out tournaments still.

Maybe firing him will be expensive or inconvenient. You know i doubt he will win CL this year. I hope i am wrong because i would like English team to win it, but I doubt it.

You never know, something special can happen :) I hope Emery stays for
longer than 5 years if this go well

When the sun rises in the west and sets in the east. When the seas go dry and mountains blow in the wind like leaves.Then titles will return to Arsenal's cabinet.. and not before.

.

https://www.football365.com/news/man-united-fans-stop-clicking-stop-buying-stop-reading

A good article that should be read by everyone in this thread.

Marcus2011

I would suggest for you to look up his net spend as well though. It will surprise you.

Actually, I can't find this. Mind sharing me with a link?

Mourinho came and he did exactly what he said he would do! It is like being thrown into the cage with two lions and come out stronger lion yourself. That is why i think pundits are full of sh8t and often talk out of their a8ss by disrespecting him showing him as mediocre. They would dream to achieve a quarter of what he achieved during his career. Only ones I gave just a bit of respect is Neville and Carragher, others always talk non sense because they were non sense professionals themselves or never had a football IQ higher than average football fan.

Don't get me wrong, what he achieved was excellent, but he does have a lot of flaws. He doesn't really seem to do that good after season 3. and nowadays even season 2. I'm not sure if he is struggling to motivate his players, under huge pressure.... Not sure, but if he really wants to relieve pressure by talking about other teams, not gonna end well imo.

I do feel mixed about his tactics as they aren't working out as they used to anymore. So, maybe a time away will do him good, although i hope he stays in EPL because he brings excitement into the league. Other than Klopp we have some boring managers who doesn't bring anything fun into press conference or during the game. Again, this game is about entertainment and Mou brings ratings up, hate him or love him. Any publicity is always good publicity. I am sure United won't mind either as longest he wins and apparently with beautiful style as they are nostalgic still about old days.

As an Arsenal fan, the positive thing I see about this is that nowadays I get to talk about it. The people in the press conference laughed at Mourinho and I'm laughing myself really truly and honestly.

Sure, but his job is not win EPL titles with this team. Sheikh spent money to make monster team to dominate CL and again EPL is expected to be dominated with such a team. If Pep can't make City CL champions, then there is always another manager... for example Zidane ;) Zidane wins CL and did it 3 times. Unlike Pep who won it on the back of the controversial referee decisions both in 2009 and 2011 ( I think Arsenal was also one of the victim teams with Persie incident) campaigns. Pep is a great league manager not sure about knock out tournaments still.

True, City always want that CL, they will continue to try their hardest to get to it, PSG has a similar approach.

When the sun rises in the west and sets in the east. When the seas go dry and mountains blow in the wind like leaves.Then titles will return to Arsenal's cabinet.. and not before.

Lol I hope you will be very very wrong.