2 years ago since first thread. A month ago since that thread got updated and then closed.

In order:

Tier 1
Real
PSG
Bayern

Barca (a bit behind)

Tier 2
Juventus
City
Chelsea
United
Atletico Madrid
Dortmund

Tier 3
Arsenal
Spurs
Roma
Sevilla
Liverpool
Monaco

Tier 4
Napoli
Milan
Porto
RB Leipzig
Inter
Benfica
Schalke
Sporting CP
Leicester
Zenit
CSKA Moskva
Besiktas
Galatasaray
Everton
PSV Einhoven
Basel
Ajax
Feyenoord
Celtic

.some of you said that PSG shouldn't be up there (still think so?) and that Real should be in their own league (still think so?). At this time I'd put Chelsea above Atletico. They're just not as good as a year or two ago. United and City have certainly proved themselves. Will be fun to watch City - Chelsea this week. Bayern is still definatively up there no matter that they lost big to PSG.

Juve in tier 1? Are Juve a better team than Chelsea?

@yvan21 lol, I dribbled myself away. Corrected.

@golazo huh?

Come on guys. Let's face it. Barca, Real, Bayern and now, probably PSG too, would all be favorites odds wise if they'd face Juventus.

Alright. Like this. Which teams would you say have the biggest chance of winning this years champions league? Now, before it all has really started..

The bigger chance a team would have the better you consider them to be, right?

Bring it.

@KTBFFHSWE
Nice to see I wasn't crazy and forgot how to properly read English :p

On the subject, I thought we were taking into consideration the recent previous seasons though :p I mean that's the only thing we can base our list on, in order to try to be as objective as possible. For example, you have Leicester in tier 4 for some reason which I'm guessing is because of them winning Premier league and having a decent champions league run last season. PSG have underperformed for the squad they have in recent years in the champions league and they even managed to not win the French League title last season, so just based on what we know they have not yet proven to be in tier 1. Yes they've greatly improved their attack, but without enough information yet it's just speculation as of today to judge whether they are on par with the likes of Madrid, Barcelona, Bayern, or Juventus.

It's all just speculation at this point whether PSG is tier 1 or 2, so that's not to say that you're wrong and I'm right. They might win the title this season or have another subpar performance and then we'll know for sure :p

My Top 20 based on performances (ligue and CL) & team potential. I might be a little generous with both manchester teams but they have been very impressive and have amazing squads.

Tier S: (1-3)

• 1.Real Madrid (have underperformed lately, but have had lot of injuries and I'm pretty sure than in a a big game scenario they will always show up and be favourites)
• 2.PSG (would be favourite vs any opponent except Real Madrid & Barca, also when you beat Bayern 3-0, are top of your league, and conceded 0 in champion's league so far with the stats that they have and signings they did, you deserve tier 1)
• 2.Barcelona (thought they would drop in form but they proved me wrong, top of league, they also concede only 2 goals in liga+CL combined)

Tier 1: (4-7)

• 4.Bayern (Having some troubles lately, still top team obviously, doesn't need much to go to tier 1)
• 5.Juventus (Expect more from them, seem more fragile than usual, are still a top team capable of wining any game)
• 6.Manchester City (Playing very well, on the rise, need to confirm to keep going up)
• 6.Manchester United (Playing very well, on the rise, need to confirm to keep going up)

Tier 2: (8-12)

• 8.Dortmund (on the rise, still very strong team)
• 9.Atletico Madrid (Rocky start, still are a very dangerous team in big games)
• 9.Chelsea (strong team)
• 11.Napoli (deserves to be here based on performance)
• 11.Spurs (strong team)

Tier 3: (13-20)

• 13.Sevilla (on the rise)
• 14.Monaco (needs to stabilize and win in CL to go up)
• 14.Inter(on the rise)
• 15.Arsenal (still a strong team, but needs to be more consistant)
• 16.Porto (solid team)
• 17.Liverpool (solid team, needs to start winning again)
• 18.RB Leipzig (solid team)
• 19.Lazio (on the rise)
• 20.Roma (might drop out)

^nice stuff but Monaco is way too below, same as Napoli, imo both of them are more of tier 2 than United, Atletico is surely tier 2 at the moment.

@Louis Good one, Monaco might deserve to be higher though. Chelsea as well. Otherwise, I mostly agree with you. :D

After having watched last game where Chelsea were the by far the superior team to Aletico I doubt that they should be ranked above.

Just to clarify. NO. We do not take into account other seasons. We take into account the way they perform NOW.

If you take Leicester for example, they'd easily put on a show against the teams positioned next to them. Schalke
Sporting CP, Zenit, CSKA Moskva, Besiktas. No doubt about that. Leicester isn't a bad team.

Also, I'm just gonna leave this right here.

Oops. But maybe you know hella lot more than the pundits and experts?

I rest my case.

Also, did Croatian seriously just say that Monaco is better than united lol. Oh, no.

Again, look at the odds above. Monaco is at 150 times the money to win CL. United at 10.

Or did I missunderstand you?

@KTB I agree Chelsea is better than Atletico, especially at the moment, Atletico sadly lost form last season and are struggling to find it back. Don't think they will get that many chance to win CL now. :(

Wow, Real and PSG odds are similar.

(In current form)

1.Real
2.PSG
3.Barcelona
4.City
5.United
6.Juventus
7.Chelsea
8.Bayern
9.Atlético
10.Tottenham

I love the way you guys put Napoli in higher tier than Arsenal, what was the last thing they actually won?

These teams should be ranked by their squad, manager, form and result they have. Not 'how good some club is at moment'. Because you just can't say this team is better at the moment. You can't judge that by one match or something. These should be results and expectations. Not who won and when won.

@KTBFFH, one win of Chelsea over Atletico doesn't mean they are better. Few injuries and Chelsea's season can be in danger, also it is first season Conte is playing UCL with Chelsea, and Conte doesn't have some glorious record in CL, unlike Simeone. Didn't Chelsea also barely get point against Arsenal, at home? Didn't you beat Atletico by last second goal (tho you were better - but nobody would care if it ended 1-1).

Monaco deserves to be in tier 2 even more than United does. Because if we really minded a drop of form Monaco had only in CL group stage, doesn't Real have to go down because of their La Liga form? In the league they are second to much stronger PSG. Last season most of their players were worse in first than second half of season. They also were most of time 2nd or 3rd to Nice/PSG. They don't even use Keita Balde at the moment. Their squad needs some time because they lost key players and Jardim is trying to make new ones fit the system.

Does someone really need reminder they were in semifinals of CL beating City, Tottenham, Bayer and Dortmund to it?

Odds are worst thing you can bring in football discussion. You know that Dynamo Kiev is ranked above Dortmund, Roma, Monaco and Leizig, right?

This lists can't be 'correct', that's why they are mostly pointless.

@quikzy, reached far more than Arsenal anyways. You don't need trophies when your team scores three goals in so many consecutive matches in league (most defensive league amongst top 5 to be accurate). Also being on top of table above Juventus, Inter, Lazio, Roma and etc. They also played better than Bayern, Atletico (not second leg) and Juventus against Madrid. Just some luck and they would be CL contenders in that season. They beated Lazio 4-1, they beated Nice in playoffs, just before the end of season they would kill all midtable teams without even trying.

They have attack that's having numbers comparable to other great trios. I really think Arsenal can't match it at the moment but some displays in PL should prove that they can do it (you desperately need a DM though, although it was fine against Chelsea).

@Croatian I respect your opinion and your points. I love the way they play forward specially because of Hamsik (who is from mine country). But being top after 7 rounds is not a reason to be suddenly better than Arsenal. If we count only this season? Then yeah, you're right, but otherwise I disagree. They were never a contenders for CL imo, they were never even close to beat Real in 2 legs yet alone winning the competition. I'd love to play them (which may actually happen) because they play some nice football. However I still stay behind the point that I don't think Napoli "reached far more" despite not winning anything, but they are in UCL so..

^you are Slovak? Nice stuff ;) Hamsik was bit out of form but he is getting his confidence back, he scored goal this weekend. They actually were really close to Real knowing they had shaky defence most of time, they had lead but Morata proved to be to good on that day. However Sarri is brilliant and I expect big stuff from him this season. I think their range at the moment is higher/bigger than Arsenal (I mean Arsenal is sadly in UEL so I couldn't properly judge). I just think Arsenal's FA Cup isn't gamechanger in this.

Just to clarify. NO. We do not take into account other seasons. We take into account the way they perform NOW.

Right now:

Tier 1:

Barcelona, PSG, Man City, Man United

Tier 2:

Real Madrid, Chelsea, Juventus, Napoli, Tottenham

Based on points won so far in Europe and domestic leagues.

Ok, just to make it clear. for MY LIST I took into account mainly their form in national leagues and other competitions BUT ALSO their squad and what their potential is. THIS MEANS that if a somewhat similar squad has had last season a good season (for exemple Real Madrid) I did take it into account. By doing this I think that it fixes TO A CERTAIN EXTEND temporary bad/good form and makes the list more realistic and not 100% based on just a couple of games.

For MY LIST I also had a look at every team i mentioned and their stats, at your comments and at various power rankings that I found online. So I believe my list is pretty accurate.

What my list shows is how if different teams go against each other, I believe you could take this list to establish a favourite of the outcome. For teams on the same tier (except perhaps tier 3 that has a bit more teams) the odds would be 50/50 more or less.

Obviously this is not an exact science at all and thank god for that oher wise how boring would football be ;).

So my point is: Chill ^^

Just to clarify. NO. We do not take into account other seasons. We take into account the way they perform NOW.... Based on points won so far in Europe and domestic leagues.

Why you didn't include Tottenham (ahead of Chelsea) & Sevilla (ahead of Real Madrid) then? If you're going to make rules, at least follow them.

Thx I added Tottenham. BTW Tier 1 is for the maxed out teams and those teams are pretty much top in their groups in CL and domestic leagues so even if Chelsea has max points in Europe they are not leaders in PL.