One of these 2 is a handball and 2nd one isn't can you guess which one?

The Aston Villa?

Burnley, its Burnley bro.

Okay, if I'm being honest with you guys, if we take only the rule into consideration, then, I think both call are spot-on.

Attacking player touch the ball with his arm or hand in the box before a goal or goal occassion, no matter if behind it, it would have been it body, he get penalized for it. So yeah, handball for the Fulham one.

As for the Burnley one, I think this one is up to interpretation but most of the time, on such a occassion, i think that refs with the current rule would favor Burnley. Arm are below the shoulder, obviously impossible to move them out of the way and even if he propably should have put his arm behind his back, its still not that excessively unnatural like DarthFooty said (he is moving toward Pepe so I can kind of get why his arm are like that, still not the best way to have your arm in the box imho).

Now if we don't think about the rule but more about the spirit of the game, its completely different.

But yeah, its a question of who we want to advantage, do we want attacking player to be able to win penality simply by fleaking the ball on an arm? Or do we rather defender can get away with moving their arm how they want while moving into the box as long as it below their shoulder?

Personally, I think the whole problem come from the punishment from handball in the surface. A goal is sometime so crucial in football, therefore, getting a penality for a stupid handball seem quite harsh. I heard someone talk of punishing unatentional handball in the surface with an indirect free-kick. Kinda like that idea a bit more, feel it would be a bit better in term of fairplay and spirit of the game,

putting your hands and arms behind your back a natural position?

All defenders are learn to put their arms behind the back, because until those new rules this would be penalty 10/10 times.

As a forward, one of the moves I will do is to flick the ball up and into the arm or hand, to try and force the ref into a choice. The player, just doing their defensive duty would have no option to avoid it unless they pulled the arms back, but what does that do for me now as the forward.... I have an easy time getting around, can push the defender off balance easier, all because they don't have their normal counterbalance abilities with arms in more natural positions. Fair?

Well, how is it fair that defender can stick their arm like in picture above and save the ball? Pepe is not even shooting the ball into the player, he tries to chip him and sprint over him, is that fair to save the ball? This is in no way balancing while defending. How all these years defenders can balance without sticking their arms as far as possible?

Would you be mad if this was called a penalty against your team?

@quikzyyy He isn't saving it though, your talking like he has his hands like that on purpose and he is hoping to stop the ball with them. No defender would think like that. He is being a bit reckless for sure but should he be penalized for it, especially considering once Pepe touch the ball in the air to chip him, theres nothing he can do about his arm?

For me its depend on your interpretation, personnally, because he got really zero chance to move his arm, i would tend to say its shouldn't be a pen but I can understand how Arsenal fan especially doesn't find that explanation enough, especially considering his arms position.

Edit: Heck, after checking a bit, it seem even Burnley fans think that was a penalty. I don't know what to say at this point. XD

Most people correctly agree they were both wrong decisions.

Anyway guys, I don't have much more to say about the Burnley one, I reached a point where I'm confused on how I feel about the whole incident after checking too much info on it (it all contractic each other as well).

One thing I just read though is that they are going to change the rule about attacking handball and when it will be put in effect, situation like the Fulham one will no longer be considered a handball. Thats a good start at least.

I completely agree your thinking but, I don't think it can be used as an excuse that "there's nothing he can do about his arm".

If every defender does this saying he had no time to put his hand down, this is not a natural position, this is not defending, he even puts his arm straight to the ball when you look at the replay.

While I stated that I am not a fan of the arm in a "natural" position being called for a handball, the Burnley (thank you for the correction) call was a handball. You can see that he stiffens the arm and almost extends it out, which for me is no longer natural.

I still would love to see Refs and VAR use common sense more, but we do know there are a lot of factors that play into things.

I had a Ref call a handball on me as the ball hit my elbow... I was turning away and my near arm was tucked into my body. The player hit the shot 3 yards from me and hit my elbow on the arm closest to the player. The same arm tucked into my body as I was turning, so nothing was extended, arm was straight down, 3 yards away.... Handball..... Nothing I could do, he wasn't going to overrule himself.

There will always be dumb calls, but with VAR, you would expect a higher level of decision-making since they can literally slow it all down to watch from several angles. At best VAR is fantastic... At worst is it just as corruptible.

Well damn quikzyyy. You're right, the more I look a this and the more the way his move his arm feel really weird, like he wanted to take more place. Seem like he even instinctively move his arm, don't know if it was to block the ball or just a stupid reflex but it feel more and more like Burnley got lucky with the ref decision there. :(

It doesn't count if he screamed " Goal keeper "

@tiki

😂🤣

Did you also play football when you were younger saying LAST MAN IS GOALKEEPER?

Yes