Zakzook
11 years ago
Is he back? again? Maura?
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Zakzook
11 years ago
Is he back? again? Maura?
Wolfie
11 years ago
I agree, tiki-taka ball possession tactic is not as effective as it once was. Also, welcome to the forum.
tiki_taka
11 years ago
Edited
End of Guardiola useless possession and dependance on a focal point : Maybe. But thats not Tiki-taka.
Every team will adapt now to Parking the bus, every team will build a squad with a perfect defense and tall strong 9 to destroy the bus...
Its about motivation, we cant say that Bayern or Barça that they are over, when you win everything your hunger is lower than those who wait for their time of glory, but it is a cycle and having Real Madrid as eternal rivals is a good thing for Barça because competition was and will always be at its best.
If you look what Madrid did to catch up Barça in term of results was out of this world, millions spent, big coaches and high pressure to be at the same level of the ennemy.
Bayern needs a proper rival in Germany or at least in Europe to keep on progressing, yesterday i felt that our main rival took a revenge for us against Bayern, i didnt believe myself supporting Madrid yesterday :).
End of Guardiola useless possession and dependance on a focal point : yes. But thats not Tiki-taka
tuan_jinn
11 years ago
lolzz I posted this yesterday (before you post about end of tiki)
http://footyroom.com/forum/football-talk/barcas-out-bayerns-out-peps-out-the-end-of-tiki-taka-58302
In this post, I said, what Bayern played was not tiki_taka it was just cluless boring possession game, tiki_taka is about high pressing, super fast and accurate one two. The moment you stop doing that, you left tiki_taka
Lodatz
11 years ago
Edited
@tuan_jinn: Well, not quite. The tiki taka principle was about ball retention, and being in total control of the ball. High pressing is actually a separate tactic, used in conjunction with tiki taka to make it more effective.
For example, two or three players in the team dink the ball back and forth to one another, at close range, in order to draw out the opposition, and create a hole in the defense. Then they attempt to exploit that hole by all attacking at once. THAT's tiki taka.
It doesn't always work. in fact, if you actually look at it, it doesn't work very often, and the defense get the ball away again. What DOES (or did) work, is that because the ball went right back to Barcelona (especially when they were pressing high with their 6-second rule), they could just repeat the process again and again until they finally get their goal(s).
By controlling the game and always seeking to have possession, the principle is to make sure that the opposition never get to play the way they want to play, and always have to play the way Barcelona (and now Bayern) wanted them to play. It's actually something a lot of people came to see as boring. Even more boring than this 'bus parking' stuff.
The thing is: it's been on the decline for a few years now. Chelsea showed the way in 2012, but simply not playing this game. They held their shape, refused to be drawn out of position, and thus refused to give Barcelona those easy holes to exploit. And it worked. Even with 10 men, it worked.
Bayern did the same last year, with the added bonus of having world-class wingers able to exploit Barca's lack of pace at the back, and punished them thoroughly. Mourinho had been doing the same thing with Madrid in the league, against Barca, for their last 3 or 4 encounters.
Hell, Brazil did it to Spain, last summer.
Add now, Madrid have done the same to Guardiola's Bayern, and Simeone's Atletico did it to Barcelona themselves.
It's not that tiki-taka is dead, it's that it needs to evolve to learn how to deal with the fact that the rest of Europe has caught up, and figured out how to stop it. There needs to be MORE than simply holding possession, and trying to goad your opposition into giving you spaces.
They need more ideas.
@tuan_jinn: Well, not quite. The tiki taka principle was about ball retention, and being in total control of the ball. High pressing is actually a separate tactic, used in conjunction with tiki taka to make it more effective.
For example, two or three players in the team dink the ball back and forth to one another, at close range, in order to draw out the opposition, and create a hole in the defense. Then they attempt to exploit that hole by all attacking at once. THAT's tiki taka.
It doesn't always work. in fact, if you actually look at it, it doesn't work very often, and the defense get the ball away again. What DOES (or did) work, is that because the ball went right back to Barcelona (especially when they were pressing high with their 6-second rule), they could just repeat the process again and again until they finally get their goal(s).
By controlling the game and always seeking to have possession, the principle is to make sure that the opposition never get to play the way they want to play, and always have to play the way Barcelona (and now Bayern) wanted them to play. It's actually something a lot of people came to see as boring. Even more boring than this 'bus parking' stuff.
The thing is: it's been on the decline for a few years now. Chelsea showed the way in 2012, but simply not playing this game. They held their shape, refused to be drawn out of position, and thus refused to give Barcelona those easy holes to exploit. And it worked. Even with 10 men, it worked.
Bayern did the same last year, with the added bonus of having world-class wingers able to exploit Barca's lack of pace at the back, and punished them thoroughly. Mourinho had been doing the same thing with Madrid in the league, against Barca, for their last 3 or 4 encounters.
Hell, Brazil did it to Spain, last summer.
Add now, Madrid have done the same to Guardiola's Bayern.
It's not that tiki-taka is dead, it's that it needs to evolve to learn how to deal with the fact that the rest of Europe has caught up, and figured out how to stop it. There needs to be MORE than simply holding possession, and trying to goad your opposition into giving you spaces.
They need more ideas.
Hitchens
11 years ago
The Tiki-Taka is a direct opposite of the play of teams like athletico nd chelsea and this teams got further in the champions league than tiki-taka adapted teams maybe tiki-taka needs a different dimension to it but as it stands Simone and Mou have proven that holding the ball for longer periods open you up to mistakes , thus giving your opponent the chance to exploit them.
Lodatz
11 years ago
^ +1.
The game always moves on.
muara10madridsta
11 years ago
Zakzook i am not nee but for this guy @hitchen welcome
personally i think 2014 has seen a new aspect to football tactics with Mou's defend nd counter play nd d trumping of Bayern by Madrid by having d ball less nd punishing d opponent on d break ....Tiki Taka is fading