1. Chelsea 60pts; Real Madrid 60pts; Juventus 57pts; Bayern Munich 55pts; Lyon 54pts

2. Man. City 55pts; Barcelona 56pts; Roma 48pts; Wolfsburg 47pts; PSG 52pts

3. Arsenal 48pts; Atletico Madrid 53pts; Napoli 42pts; Borussia M.G. 37pts; Marseille 50pts

4. Man. United 47pts; Valencia 50pts; Lazio 40pts; Schalke 04 35pts; Monaco 43pts

5. Southampton 46pts; Sevilla 45pts; Fiorentina 39pts; Augsburg 35pts; Saint Etienne 42pts

6. Liverpool 45pts; Villarreal 44pts; Sampdoria 35pts; Bayer Leverkusen 33pts; Bordeaux 41pts

7. Tottenham 44pts; Malaga 38pts; Genoa 35pts; Hoffenheim 30pts; Montpellier 39pts

EPL- span of 16 pts between first and seventh place
Liga- span of 22pts between first and seventh place
Seria A- span of 22pts between first and seventh place
Bundesliga- span of 25pts between first and seventh place
Ligue 1- span of 15pts between first and seventh place

EPL- 5 pts between first and second
Liga- 4pts between first and second
Serie A- 9pts between first and second
Bundesliga- 8pts between first and second
Ligue 1- 2pts between first and second

Its interesting to compare the leagues side by side (BPL and Ligue 1 have 26 games played, Liga and Seria A have 24, and Bundesliga 22) at this point in time.

So here is my question, how will this change at the end of the season? will gaps be narrower or wider? can we already give Juve and Bayern the titles? Who will finish in CL spots?

Keep the arguing like children to a minimum as this is not a debate between which league is better and what not.

La Liga and EPL will both grow closer as I suspect all of Chelsea, City, Barca, Madrid, and Atletico will begin to alternate dropping points due to their participation in the CL. Arsenal were never a threat to begin with, so they can be excluded from title discussions even though they are still in the CL.

The gaps between 1st and 5th in England will grow smaller due to the fact that United and Southampton are not participating in European competitions this season. Valencia will close in on the top 3 even more since they are the same. Sevilla's performance depends on how far they go into the Europa League, and same goes for Spurs.

Bayern will win by a massive margin as usual.

I don't watch Ligue 1 or Serie A, so I'm not qualified to comment on them.

Besides, a 7th place team has literally no effect on the top 5, which are the ones that matter. Here is a better point differential between them.

England 1-5: 14 points
Spain 1-5: 15 points
Germany 1-5: 20 points
Italy 1-5: 18 points
France 1-5: 12 points

As you can see, Ligue 1, EPL, and La Liga are relatively close, but Serie A and Bundesliga have considerably larger margins.

I'd say it's fair to compare teams placed 1-7 in the league with eachother. The team placed fifth in the Premier League automatically qualifies for the EL,and the sixth and seventh-placed teams can also qualify, depending on
the winners and runners-up of the two domestic cup competitions.

Otherwise, I agree with Dynastian. Spurs, Southampton and Pool are in great form while Chelsea and Man United aren't at their best and Arsenal and City playing in the CL takes energy from the league. Pretty sure the gap will decrease in the PL.

As to la liga, I think that the gap will increase as usual. Especially when Real are so good.

As to the others,. I think the gap will remain constant.

Real, Juve and Bayern are already clear winners to me.

"Besides, a 7th place team has literally no effect on the top 5, which are the ones that matter."

Not sure if you mean the same but I disagree with you TOTALLY. The point in giving info about top 7 was that (atleast in BPL) the 7th team in the league can still get top 4 spot. It would be pointless not giving information about Spurs who are just 3 pts from top 4 spot. Hope you get the point.

What I truly like is that the gap between Two monsters in La Liga to other teams has reduced significantly since last few years.

I hope that Wolfsburg will keep their 2nd spot and build from there. They've got one hell of a team currently, and 2-3 signings in the summer would make them EVEN better! Despite BVB's terrible season, if they get monsterous form and could win 12-13 out of their 16 games, I hope they'd make top 4. BVB's gap to Schalke (4th place) is just 10 points.

What a comeback it has been for Lyon, they've been awful (in table, haven't seen them play) 2-3 seasons.

Will be tough, but I hope AC Milan would get top 3 spot :/

I think in La Liga Real & Barca will battle for 1st place, and then Atleti, Valencia, Sevilla and Villareal for 3rd and 4th spot. You never know though, Atleti can still win the championship.

I think we can split BPL into FOUR little groups :P

1st Group: Chelsea (60pts) & Man City (55pts)

• BATTLING FOR CHAMPIONSHIP [5 point gap]

2nd Group: Arsenal (48pts), Man Utd(47pts), Southampton (46pts), Liverpool (45pts), Spurs (44pts)

• BATTLING FOR UCL SPOTS (3 & 4) [4 point gap]

3rd Group: West Ham (39pts), Swansea (37pts), Stoke (36pts), Newcastle (32pts), Everton (28pts)

• BATTLING FOR TOP 10 SPOTS (8,9,10, Moral win) [11 point gap]

4th Group: Crystal Palace (27pts), West Brom (27pts), Hull (26pts), Sunderland (25pts), QPR (22pts), Burnley (22pts), Aston Villa (22pts), Leicester (18pts)

• RELEGATION BATTLE [9 point gap]

I think 1st & 2nd group will fight for same thing till the end of the season, but Everton & Newcastle may fall to relegation battle and teams like Crystal Palace & QPR (if QPR can get their away form right) could end up fighting for top 10 spots.

Great piece of thread by you btw.

Those comparisons doesnt give many informations, we see that Ligue 1 is the most exciting one this season due to the small gap and the transition of 3 leaders, 2 inexpected ( Marseille, Lyon ) while Monaco comming stronger in second leg to make the CL race ( 3 tickects ) even better, but it doesnt give much about the level of the league nor the top 5.

But here again, CL and EL would give us more arguments and informations on the real strenght of the leagues :

Teams involved in Europe for each League :

Spain :

Real Madrid
Barcelona
Atletico Madrid
Bilbao
Villareal
Sevilla

England :

Chelsea
Man City
Arsenal
Liverpool
Tottenham
Everton

Germany :

Bayern Munich
Dortmund
Bater Leverkusen
Schalke 04
Wfl Wolfsburg
Monchen' gladbach

Italy :

Juventus
As Roma
Napoli
Inter Milan
Fiorentina
Torino

France :

Paris Saint Germain
Monaco
Guingamp

Portugal :

Porto
Sporting

Ukraine :

Shakhtar Donetsk
Dnipro Dnipropetrovsk
Dynamo Kiev

Some direct confrontations and the road of each team would give us lots of informations, one thing to know, in England some good teams arent competing in Europe im thinking about United, Southampton, and West Ham, in Spain Valencia, Malaga, Celta Vigo, Espagnol, Sociedad arent taking part from the party, in Italy Milan, Lazio, Sasaulo and Sampdoria... ( not talking about the eliminated ones, but those who couldnt participate ).

It would be great if we make, a Résumé of all the direct confrontations between the nations at the end, and compare the average strenght.

Tiki, this isnt a thread comparing strength and it isnt of the top 5 leagues, either. I picked the most popular leagues that i know get some sort of following here. This is to compare each league in terms of possibilities for each team to move up or down in their respective league and to speculate about the finish as the people above have done. I know every other cup played will take a toll on teams but that incalculable so it was pointless to even mention here.

Dy, the reason i went to 7th place was mainly for BPL as decentK pointed out.

Italy and Germany are definitely over in terms of first place but its gonna be interesting which teams make it to CL. Would be cool to see BVB make a late push and earn a spot, the same for both Milan teams.

Im glad la liga has evened out a bit this season, but i have a feeling its mostly do to the fact Real and Barca have dropped points, more than the rest of the teams earned points. Valencia could even challenge for 3rd spot its just 3pts away and atletlico have CL to worry about.

Good to see Lyon at the top but honestly it doesn't look like they will hold on very long, especially if PSG get knocked out of CL by Chelsea.

@Raimondo Both Madrid and Barça were obliged to drop points due to other teams, creditshould be given when its due and in Vigo, Sociedad,both Malaga games, Barça gave it all, Madrid against Valencia played their best but still lost.

I think Atleti oppened eyes and gave hope and motivation to other players and teams, yes the budget is limitted but you can still compete, its not that bad that Atleti motivation is contaminating some other Historical clubs and im very glad to see Valencia that near from podium or even the first place. Made good transfer buisness by bringing Rodrigo and keeping their main players...

The gap between the top 2 and the rest seemed unreachable so team concentrated on cups and CL tickets, while Atleti arrival into competition gave players and coaches hope that competing is possible, in fact the ball is round and everything is possble.

"But here again, CL and EL would give us more arguments and informations on the real strenght of the leagues"

@tiki way to misunderstand what the thread is about. Why even mention this? And besides knock-out tournaments aren't a very reliable measure for this since one bad game can destroy the hopes for future progress in the cup.

a possibility:

Villarreal/Sevilla wins EL, Valencia finnish 3rd just ahead of Atletico, Atletico loses the CL final on penalties

no CL for Atleti, gg

my bet (many pretty obvious ofc):

BL: 1. Bayern 2. Wolfsburg 3. BMG 4. Werder Bremen
La Liga: 1. Real 2. Barca 3. Valencia 4. Atletico
Serie A: 1. Juve 2. Napoli 3. Roma 4. Lazio
PL: 1. City 2. Chelsea 3. Arsenal 4. Man U
Ligue 1: 1. Lyon 2. PSG 3. Marseille 4. Bordeaux

Valencia made excellent business. For once they didn't have to sell their best player for huge sums of money (Soldado, Mata, Silva, Villa, etc.).

yeah but tbh, Negredo has thus far not been a good signing. Ok the others have

Negredo was on decline i may agree on this, but i loved Rodrigo since his years at Benfica...

and let's drop also this one here:

@knibis CL may have 5 teams from one country. So Atletico will be in CL anyway.

@Emrecan wow, that new.. and good :)

So two months have passed since i posted this originally and its time for an update:

1. Chelsea 77pts; Barcelona 81pts; Juventus 73pts; Bayern Munich 76pts; Lyon 68pts

2. Man City 67pts; Real Madrid 79pts; Lazio 59pts; Wolfsburg 61pts; PSG 68pts

3. Arsenal 67pts; Atletico Madrid 72pts; Roma 58pts; Borussia M.G. 57pts; Monaco 62pts

4. Man United 65pts; Valencia 68 pts; Napoli 56pts; Bayern Leverkusen 55pts; Saint Etienne 60pts

5. Liverpool 58pts; Sevilla 66pts; Sampdoria 50pts; Shaclke 04 42pts; Merseille 57pts

6. Tottenham 58pts; Villarreal 53pts; Fiorentina 49pts; Augsburg 42pts; Bordeaux 55pts

7. Southampton 57pts; Malaga 47pts; Torino 47pts; Hoffenheim 40pts; Montpellier 52pts

Few changes in each league and as we reach the last month of games the tables are set for some good battles.
Lyon lead in Ligue 1 but PSG have a game in hand which can take them to the title, it rests on them.
Bayern Juventus and Chelsea have pretty much won their leagues respectively.
Barcelona is looking to edge out Real but it looks like it will come down to the last few games to see who will win, a drop of form from any team can decide who will take the title.

PL: 7pts between 4th and 5th place with 4 or 5 games left to play depending on the team. Southampton has a low chance of making it to 4th place but is only 1 point from 5th place finish taking them to EL. City Arsenal and United are fighting to maintain or improve the finish as only 2 pts seperate them.

La Liga: Sevilla is fighting Valencia for the last CL spot as 2 points seperate them with 5 games to play for. Meanwhile Malaga can push for the second EL spot against Villarreal. I don't believe top 3 will change with the excpetion of the possibility of Real taking the top. It all depends on form.

Serie A: Roma was once fighting Juve and now this sit dangerously in 3rd. Lazio hit incredible form but will need to keep it up to remain in CL spot. the 2 EL spots could go to any of the teams from 4-9 place.

Bundesliga: with only 4 games left, the current CL teams are safe from losing their spots, they just have a fight for who gets to play the play off game. The 2 EL spots are still up for grabs from teams placed 5-9 (BVB has a chance for EL).

Ligue 1: PSG is expected to take a 3 point lead as they still have to play against Metz who sit second to last. Mathematically Monaco and Etienne have a chance for CL but i very much doubt it. With Merseille 3pts away Eitienne have their hands full holding down EL and could potentionally fight for CL as its 5pts away.

Has any change here shocked you? Any new predictions as we reach the last handfull of games?

-Nothing seems unexpected. This year the excitements ended too early. LaLiga looks like the best in competition.
-Real Madrid and Barcelona are heading to critical games.

-Bayern already won the league after Wolfsburg lost this weekend.
-Fortunately, Turkish League has been amazing this year.